In this episode, Loren talks with Kara Root—pastor, spiritual director, and author of The Deepest Belonging and A Pilgrimage into Letting Go—about faith, loss, and the surprising ways God rebuilds belief when certainty collapses.

Drawing from her own journey through the unraveling of a ministry-centered evangelical world, Kara reflects on how faith can be rebuilt from the ground up through pilgrimage, prayer, and honest encounters with suffering. The conversation explores the difference between inherited faith and lived faith, and why belonging to God often emerges most clearly when our illusions fall away.

They also discuss the role of Sabbath rest, spiritual practices, and pastoral leadership in helping congregations navigate seasons of change and uncertainty.

This episode offers a reflective and hopeful conversation about letting go of what no longer holds—and discovering the deeper belonging God offers in its place.

Together they explore:

• How faith can be rebuilt after the collapse of inherited religious systems

• The spiritual significance of pilgrimage and letting go

• Why belonging to God is deeper than belonging to institutions

• The role of Sabbath, prayer, and spiritual practices in sustaining faith

• How pastors and churches navigate seasons of change and uncertainty

Rev. Kara K. Root is the author of The Deepest Belonging (2021), Receiving This Life: (2023), and A Pilgrimage Into Letting Go (2025, with husband, Andy). ​Pastor of Lake Nokomis Presbyterian Church in Minneapolis, MN, a Christian community that shapes its life around worship, hospitality and Sabbath rest, she is a trained Spiritual Director and Certified Educator in the PCUSA.  Being mom to two intrepid young adults (and a goofy dog), and wife and proofreader to a wily theologian, spices up her vocational calling and keeps her fully immersed in life.   She has written for Sparkhouse, Working Preacher, Christian Century, Christianity Today, Faith and Leadership, Patheos and more. Kara leads retreats and workshops on sabbath rest, prayer practices, and church leadership and transformation.  ​​Kara and her husband, Andy, lead workshops and speak together through Root Creative, inc.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Kara's Website: https://www.karakroot.com/about.html#/

📖 Kara's Book: A Pilgrimage into Letting Go

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Andy Root

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Kelsey McGinnis

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Martha's New Book! Anne Boleyn: Reputation, Revolution, Religion, and the Queen Who Changed History Available for Pre-order now!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Kara Root, The Deepest Belonging, A Pilgrimage into Letting Go, faith after deconstruction, spiritual pilgrimage, Sabbath practices, spiritual formation, rebuilding faith, pastoral leadership, church and doubt, belonging to God, Christian spiritual practices, evangelicalism and faith transition, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren talks with Kelsey McGinnis to explore the evolution of modern worship, the lingering effects of the “worship wars,” and the growing influence of the worship industry on local congregations.

They discuss how large-scale production and publishing networks shape song selection and theology, the unseen pressures facing worship leaders, and what healthy support actually looks like in a local church. The conversation also revisits the hymns versus modern worship debate, the renewed interest in liturgy, and whether lament, silence, and stillness have space in contemporary services.

This episode offers a thoughtful, grounded look at how what we sing forms what we believe—and how churches might lead worship more intentionally in the years ahead.

Together they explore:

• The rise of contemporary praise and worship

• How the worship industry shapes theology and song selection

• The pressures facing today’s worship leaders

• Hymns, liturgy, and the place of lament

• Whether secular songs belong in church

Kelsey McGinnis is the worship correspondent for Christianity Today. She holds a PhD in musicology and teaches music and theology at Grand View University in Des Moines, Iowa, and writes broadly on Christian music and the intersection of American Christianity and popular culture. Kelsey is a coauthor of the book The Myth of Good Christian Parenting and the author of a forthcoming book about Christian diet and wellness culture.  She lives in central Iowa with her husband and three children.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Kelsey's Website: https://www.kkramermcginnis.com/

📖 Kelsey's Book: The Myth of Good Christian Parenting

🟧 Kelsey's Substack: https://kkramermcginnis.substack.com/

📱 Instagram: @kelseykmcginnis

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Michelle Van Loon

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Michael Huerter

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Robert Schuller

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Martha's New Book! Anne Boleyn: Reputation, Revolution, Religion, and the Queen Who Changed History Available for Pre-order now!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

contemporary worship, praise and worship history, worship wars, worship industry, church music theology, hymns vs modern worship, liturgy renewal, lament in worship, worship leader burnout, secular songs in church, worship culture, evangelical worship music, mainline worship styles, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren talks with Tanita Tualla Maddox, National Director for Generational Impact at Young Life and author of What Gen Z Really Wants to Know About God. Tanita offers a compelling case for cultural apologetics—understanding the lens through which Gen Z asks timeless questions like “Is God good?” She also challenges churches to move from abstract teaching to concrete spiritual practices that help young people live out their faith in real relationships.

Together they explore:

• Why headlines about Gen Z “revival” can be misleading

• The reality of low trust culture—and how to earn it

• How Gen Z defines acceptance, belonging, and safety

• Why evangelism must go beyond “just invite your friends to church”

• Practical ways churches can disciple students in a post-Christian world

• The importance of teaching young people to articulate their own testimony

• Why isolating teenagers from the broader church might be a mistake

Tanita Tualla Maddox (DMin, Phoenix Seminary) is the national director for generational impact for Young Life and serves as an associate regional director in the Mountain West Young Life region. With an expertise in contextualizing the gospel for Gen Z, Tanita has been featured on The Holy Post podcast and has been published in The Great Commission Research Journal, the Journal of Youth and Theology, and more. She has served as Young Life leader with adolescents for over twenty-six years and serves as a volunteer Young Life leader in her local community. She lives in Spokane, Washington, with her husband and two children.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Her Website: https://tanitamaddox.com/

📖 Her Book: https://www.ivpress.com/what-gen-z-really-wants-to-know-about-god

📱 Instagram & FB: @drtanitamaddox

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Mike Orr

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Martha's New Book! Anne Boleyn: Reputation, Revolution, Religion, and the Queen Who Changed History Available for Pre-order now!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Tanita Tualla Maddox, Gen Z faith, What Gen Z Really Wants to Know About God, Young Life, generational ministry, youth ministry strategy, cultural apologetics, post-Christian culture, evangelism training, Gen Z and church, belonging and acceptance, discipling teenagers, low trust culture, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren talks with Bill and Kristi Gaultiere, founders of Soul Shepherding and co-authors of Deeply Loved: Receiving and Reflecting God’s Great Empathy for You. Together, they explore why emotional health is not optional for Christian leaders—and why empathy begins with receiving God’s love, not just offering it to others. Drawing from decades of experience in psychology, spiritual direction, and ministry leadership, the Gaultieres unpack the difference between empathy and indulgence, how unaddressed shame leads to burnout, and why pastors must have a safe place to be listened to and prayed for.

They also discuss:

• Why emotions are gifts—but terrible masters

• The danger of processing unresolved wounds from the platform

• Burnout warning signs every pastor should recognize

• Compassion fatigue and isolation in ministry

• Why leaders must receive pastoral care, not just provide it

This conversation is a candid and practical guide for church leaders who want their ministry to flow from healing and authenticity rather than exhaustion and performance.

Bill is a psychologist (PhD) and ordained pastor and Kristi is a licensed professional counselor (PsyD). Together they lead Soul Shepherding, which is a nonprofit ministry to help pastors, leaders, churches, and others to go deeper with Jesus in emotional health and loving leadership. They lead immersive retreats that integrate Jesus-centered psychology and spiritual formation. Participants have the option to earn a Certificate in Spiritual Direction to improve their relationship skills and earn side income as a spiritual director or coach. They are authors of a number of soul care books, including Journey of the Soul, which was #1 on Amazon in Christian Counseling, and Healthy Feelings, Thriving Faith. Their newest book is Deeply Loved: Receiving and Reflecting God’s Great Empathy for You.

Bill and Kristi have provided over 100,000 hours helping clients in therapy or spiritual direction. They were also personally mentored by Dallas and Jane Willard for many years. They have developed a unique approach to spiritual direction that is informed by their Jesus-centered psychology. Their two-year Certificate in Spiritual Direction training program is a hybrid of in person retreats and online training (or it can be completed 100% online) and currently has over 150 students participating. 

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Their Website: www.soulshepherding.org

🌐 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/billgaultiere

📱 Instagram & FB: @soulshepherding

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Chuck DeGroat

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Josh Packard

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Tara Beth Leach

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Martha's New Book! Anne Boleyn: Reputation, Revolution, Religion, and the Queen Who Changed History Available for Pre-order now!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Bill Gaultiere, Kristi Gaultiere, Soul Shepherding, Deeply Loved book, empathy in ministry, pastoral burnout, emotional health for pastors, compassion fatigue, spiritual direction training, church leadership formation, sustainable ministry, shame and leadership, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren is joined by Len Tang, Director of the Church Planting Initiative at Fuller Seminary, for a wide-ranging conversation about mission, formation, and the future of church planting.

Drawing on his experience planting churches and training planters across diverse contexts, Len reframes church planting as a normal part of the church’s life cycle—one that includes birth, growth, reproduction, and sometimes faithful endings. The conversation explores why growth alone is an inadequate metric, how global migration is reshaping mission fields, and why new expressions of church must be deeply contextual, diverse, and disciple-centered.

Loren and Len also discuss the emotional and spiritual realities of church planting: grief, resilience, failure, and the importance of practices like Sabbath, lament, and community support. Rather than treating church planting as a silver bullet, the episode makes the case for forming leaders with character, humility, and a deep grounding in the way of Jesus.

This is a thoughtful conversation for pastors, planters, denominational leaders, and anyone discerning how the church can participate faithfully in God’s mission today.

• Why church planting is a normal—and finite—part of church life

• Growth, reproduction, and the reality of church endings

• Global migration and new mission fields close to home

• Moving beyond one-size-fits-all planting models

• Bivocational ministry, social entrepreneurship, and sustainability

• Character over charisma in church planting leadership

• Grief, failure, and resilience in ministry

• Discipleship as the true measure of fruitfulness

Len Tang is the Director of the Church Planting Initiative at Fuller Seminary, and has planted two churches: Cedar Creek Church in Sherwood, Oregon, and Missio Community Church in Pasadena, CA. He received a B.S. in Electrical Engineering and Computer Science from UC Berkeley and an MDiv from Fuller Seminary. He is married to Amy and they have three young adult boys, a cat, and an electric motorcycle.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Fuller Website: churchplanting.fuller.edu

🌐 Website: Faithful Resistance.com

📱 Len's Instagram & FB: @len.tang

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Tim Morey

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Nick Warnes

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Dwight Zscheile

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Martha's New Book! Anne Boleyn: Reputation, Revolution, Religion, and the Queen Who Changed History Available for Pre-order now!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Len Tang, church planting, Fuller Seminary church planting initiative, missional church, discipleship and mission, global migration and church, bivocational ministry, church growth vs faithfulness, church planter formation, character over charisma, failure in ministry, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren is joined by Dwight Zscheile and Blair Pogue for a wide-ranging conversation about their book, Embracing the Mixed Ecology, and what it means to form Christian communities in a changing world.

Drawing on their experience in congregational leadership, theological education, and diocesan innovation, Dwight and Blair make the case for a mixed ecology of church—where inherited congregations, new communities, fresh expressions, digital ministry, and lay-led initiatives work together to embody the gospel. Rather than dismissing institutions or chasing quick fixes, the conversation emphasizes discipleship, listening to neighbors, and adapting church forms without abandoning the substance of the faith.

The episode also explores why activism alone cannot sustain Christian identity, how polarization distorts formation, and why the church must recover practices that shape people into a distinct way of life centered on Jesus.

• What a “mixed ecology” of church actually means

• Why inherited churches still matter—and where they fall short

• Fresh expressions, microchurches, and lay-led ministry

• Discipleship vs. political or cultural substitutes for faith

• Listening as the starting point for mission

• Digital ministry as doorway, not replacement

• When and how churches may need to end faithfully

The Rev. Dwight Zscheile, Ph.D. is professor of congregational mission and leadership at Luther Seminary in St. Paul, Minnesota. He is author of Embracing the Mixed Ecology: Inherited and New Forms of Christian Community Flourishing Together (with Blair Pogue, Seabury Books 2025), Leading Faithful Innovation: Following God into a Hopeful Future (with Michael Binder and Tessa Pinkstaff, Fortress, 2023), Participating in God’s Mission: A Theological Missiology for the Church in America (with Craig Van Gelder, Eerdmans, 2018), The Agile Church: Spirit-Led Innovation in an Uncertain Age (Morehouse Publishing, 2014), People of the Way: Renewing Episcopal Identity (Morehouse Publishing, 2012) and The Missional Church in Perspective: Mapping Trends and Shaping the Conversation (with Craig Van Gelder, Baker Academic 2011), editor of Cultivating Sent Communities: Missional Spiritual Formation (Eerdmans, 2012) and co-editor (with Ed Olsworth-Peter) of The Starter’s Way: Leading New Contextual Christian Communities (Church Publishing, 2025). A graduate of Stanford University (BA), Yale University (MDiv) and Luther Seminary (PhD, Congregational Mission and Leadership), he has served congregations in Minnesota and Virginia. Dwight’s experience growing up in a secular home in California has shaped his commitment to helping the church cultivate Christian community with neighbors in today’s changing world.

The Rev. Canon Blair Pogue is the Canon for Innovation for the Episcopal Church in Minnesota. In that capacity she helps congregations all over the state go deeper in their practice of the Christian faith and rethink how they form disciples and engage the communities surrounding their church. She also runs learning communities for Episcopalians wanting to learn how to form Christian community with neighbors where they live, work, and play. Before joining Bishop Craig Loya’s staff she was the rector of St. Matthew’s Episcopal Church in St. Paul for 16 ½ years, and before that she served two churches in the Diocese of Virginia, with a special focus on Christian formation. She is a graduate of Luther Seminary (D.Min in Congregational Mission and Leadership), Yale Divinity School (M.Div), and Whitman College (B.A.).

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Their Book: Embracing the Mixed Ecology

🌐 Dwight's Website: https://www.dwightzscheile.com/

📧 Blair's Email: blair.p@episcopalmn.org

🎧 Episodes Referenced: William Harrison

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Dwight Zscheile, Blair Pogue, Embracing the Mixed Ecology, mixed ecology church, fresh expressions, inherited church, church innovation, post-Christian ministry, discipleship formation, lay-led ministry, digital church, future of the church, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Martha Tatarnic is joined by Rose Hudson‑Wilkin, Bishop of Dover, for a wide-ranging conversation rooted in her memoir, The Girl from Montego Bay.

Drawing on her journey from a childhood in Jamaica to episcopal leadership in the Church of England, Bishop Rose reflects on poverty, belonging, the discovery of God’s love, and the clarity of call that sustained her through repeated rejection. She speaks candidly about racism in the church, the pressure of being “the first,” and the cost of leadership when institutions lag behind the Spirit.

The conversation also explores motherhood and ministry, Scripture as a lived practice, faith in public life, and what Bishop Rose believes the church most urgently needs now: confident Christians who live their faith beyond the church door.

This episode offers pastoral wisdom and spiritual encouragement for anyone discerning vocation, navigating institutional resistance, or seeking a faith marked by courage, joy, and love.

• Discerning a call without visible role models

• Growing up poor without growing up diminished

• Scripture as a source of belonging and confidence

• Racism, representation, and leadership pressure

• Motherhood and ministry as shared vocation

• Why the church needs confident Christians now

• Faith lived publicly, not defensively

The Rt Revd Rose Hudson-Wilkin, CD, MBE was born and raised in Jamaica before coming to the UK to study. Ordained to the priesthood in 1994, in 2007 she was appointed as a Chaplain to Her Late Majesty the Queen and in 2010, became the first female appointed to the position of the 79th Chaplain to the Speaker of the House of Commons. In November 2019 she was consecrated as a Bishop in the Church of England and installed in Canterbury Cathedral. In May 2023, Bishop Rose was one of three female bishops to make history by playing a part in the coronation of King Charles lll. Her autobiography, ‘The Girl From Montego Bay’ was published in January 2025. Bishop Rose is in wide demand as a preacher and speaker undertaking engagements both nationally and internationally, as well as making regular appearances in the media.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Her Book: The Girl from Montego Bay

🌐 Facebook: Bishop of Dover

🎧 Audiobook: Listen for Free

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Rose Hudson-Wilkin, Bishop of Dover, Bishop in Canterbury, The Girl from Montego Bay, women in ministry, Black church leadership, calling and vocation, racism in the church, Church of England, confident Christians, faith and public life, memoir theology, Future Christian Podcast, Martha Tatarnic

In this episode, Loren is joined by Rev. Dr. Josh Hayden for a deeply honest conversation about remissioning churches and navigating loss. Drawing from his work with congregations across denominations—and from his own experience of profound personal grief—Josh reflects on what it means to embrace change that is rooted in love, sacrifice, and hope.

Rather than treating renewal as a technical fix, the conversation explores remissioning as a discipleship-centered process that requires dying to old versions of ourselves so new life can emerge. Together, Loren and Josh wrestle with fear, resistance to change, the pace of transformation, and why churches often avoid the very practices that form people to live faithfully through loss.

Josh Hayden is the cofounder and copresident of `Iwa Collaborative, which helps leaders fly high and and live low as they lead through change processes in their community. He runs remissioning trainings through `Iwa Collaborative across various denominational, non-denominational, and global networks. Hayden is the senior pastor at First Baptist Church in Ashland, Virginia. He has worked and led in nonprofit organizations, church plants, and established churches. He has a doctorate in leadership and organizational change from Duke Divinity School and is the author of Sacred Hope. He serves on the boards of numerous nonprofits, and he and his family live near Richmond, Virginia.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 His Book: Remissioning Church

🌐 Website:  `Iwa Collaborative

🎧 Episode Referenced: Jack Shitama

🎧 Episode Referenced: Angela Gorrell

🎧 Episode Referenced: Andrew Root

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Josh Hayden, remissioning churches, church renewal, church change, leading through grief, discipleship and change, pastoral leadership, Edwin Friedman, family systems theory, cross before resurrection, church revitalization vs remissioning, grief and faith, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren is joined by Michael Huerter to talk about hybrid church, online worship, and how technology is reshaping participation in Christian life. Drawing from Michael’s experience in worship leadership and digital ministry, the conversation explores how the pandemic accelerated changes already underway and why worship has always involved mediation and technology. Loren and Michael discuss common assumptions about online participation, the pressure placed on worship leaders to produce spiritual experiences, and how hybrid models can expand access without reducing worship to consumption. Rather than treating digital worship as a temporary solution or a threat to embodiment, the episode examines how churches can think more carefully about participation, formation, and accessibility in a hybrid context.

Topics include:

• What “hybrid church” actually means

• Why worship has always been mediated

• Assumptions about online participation

• Pressure on worship leaders to perform

• Hybrid worship and accessibility

This episode is a practical conversation for pastors, worship leaders, and church leaders navigating worship in a digital and hybrid age.

Michael Huerter (PhD, Baylor University) is a pastor at Holmeswood Baptist Church in Kansas City, Missouri, where he leads worship and works to build community and connection. As a lifelong church musician and digital native, he is interested in engaging with and contributing to scholarship that bridges the gap between research and practical ministry.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 His Book: The Hybrid Congregation

🎧 Episode Referenced: DOC Roundtable

🎧 Episode Referenced: Andrew Draper

🎧 Episode Referenced: David Taylor

🎧 Episode Referenced: The Pressure to Perform

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Hybrid church, hybrid worship, online worship, digital church, worship technology, mediated worship, worship leadership, participation in worship, embodiment and accessibility, church after COVID, future of worship, Michael Huerter, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren is joined by Kory Wilcoxson and Erin Cash to talk about their book, Thriving Church: What We Can Learn from Faithful Congregations, and the real-world practices of congregations navigating change with courage and clarity.

Drawing from years of congregational research and ministry experience, the conversation explores how churches can remain faithful to their calling without being governed by fear, metrics, or nostalgia. Kory and Erin reflect on the importance of grounding ministry in Scripture, revisiting mission and vision regularly, and honoring the past without being constrained by it.

Rather than equating thriving with growth, the episode makes a case for faithfulness, imagination, and adaptability—especially in mainline Protestant contexts where decline is often assumed to be the whole story.

Topics include:

• Why thriving is not the same as numerical growth

• How fear distorts mission—and how clarity restores it

• What it looks like for a church to be both “dying” and thriving

• Honoring history without letting it become a barrier to change

• Why Scripture still matters deeply for faithful congregations

This episode is a grounded, hopeful conversation for pastors and church leaders discerning how to lead well in seasons of transition.

Rev. Dr. Kory Wilcoxson has served as the Senior Pastor of Crestwood Christian Church in Lexington, Ky., since 2009. Prior to moving to Lexington, he served for twelve years as a pastor in the Chicago and Indianapolis areas. Wilcoxson holds degrees from Indiana University ((BA in Speech Communication), Ohio University (MA in Interpersonal Communication), Christian Theological Seminary (Master of Divinity), and Lexington Theological Seminary (Doctor of Divinity). Wilcoxson has served in a number of leadership positions within the Kentucky Region and Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) denomination, including moderator of the Kentucky Regional Board, chair of the Board of Directors for the Council on Christian Unity (now the Christian Unity and Interfaith Ministry), and member of the Board of Directors for Disciples Home Missions. Wilcoxson is also the executive director of Compassionate Lexington, an organization which seeks to promote the core value of compassion through concrete action. Wilcoxson has two adult daughters: Sydney and Molly. He enjoys reading, running, and rooting on his beloved Cincinnati Reds.

Erin Cash is the Project Director for the Thriving Congregations Project at Lexington Theological Seminary.  Prior to this role, Erin served as Director of Admissions at LTS for over 8 years.  She is a graduate of Greenville University in Greenville, IL, Candler School of Theology at Emory University in Atlanta, GA, and Lexington Theological Seminary in Lexington, KY. Ordained in 2006, Erin enjoys the opportunities she has to serve in pulpit supply, guest lectures, and as a lay leader in her own congregation. Erin has served as Moderator for the Christian Church In Kentucky, as co-chair of the Local Arrangements team for Regional Assembly, and as co-chair for the Local Arrangements Team of the General Assembly. She also serves as Kentucky’s representative to the General Board, chairing the General Assembly Planning Committee there.  Erin is deeply passionate about the work of the local and the Regional church. She is co-author of the book Thriving Church: What You Can Learn from Faithful Congregations now available from Chalice Press. Erin is part of a clergy couple.  Her husband, Chris, is the Senior Pastor at FCC Georgetown, having formerly served North Middletown Christian Church and Oxford Christian Church.  She is mom to Ella, who is a Junior at Murray State University. In her free time, Erin enjoys baking, hiking, exploring the National Parks, baseball games, and any experience that involves a lake, pool, or the ocean.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Their Book: Thriving Church

🎧 Episode Referenced: DOC Roundtable

🎧 Episode Referenced: Dawn Weaks

🎧 Episode Referenced: Chad Brooks

Connect with Future Christian:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Kory Wilcoxson, Erin Cash, Thriving Church book, Thriving Congregations, mainline Protestant churches, church decline, faithful congregations, mission and vision, church leadership, pastoral leadership, Disciples of Christ, Lexington Theological Seminary, fear vs mission, Christian formation, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

They discuss how leaders navigate vulnerability in public roles, including the challenge of knowing what to share, what to hold privately, and how unresolved pain can unintentionally shape preaching and leadership. The conversation addresses the tension between honesty and responsibility, especially when leaders are still processing their own questions or struggles.

Loren and Martha also talk about spiritual practices that have become increasingly important to them, particularly shared prayer and the Daily Office as grounding rhythms amid institutional anxiety and uncertainty. They reflect on how decline, fatigue, and pressure to perform can distort leadership, and why steadiness and formation matter when outcomes are unclear.

Topics include:

• Vulnerability and disclosure in pastoral leadership

• The difference between honesty and oversharing

• Prayer and the Daily Office as stabilizing practices

• Institutional anxiety and leadership pressure

• Leading faithfully without clear outcomes

👉 Subscribe to the Future Christian Podcast for ongoing conversations about leadership, theology, and the future of the church.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Future Christian Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/futurechristianpod/

📱 Martha's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/martha_tatarnic/

📱 Loren's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/richmondljr/

🟧 Future Christian Substack: https://futurechristian.substack.com/

Supporting Sponsors:

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Dennis Sanders – Producer

SEO / Keywords

Loren Richmond Jr., Martha Tatarnic, church leadership, pastoral leadership, vulnerability in leadership, spiritual practices, Daily Office, prayer rhythms, Christian formation, ministry fatigue, church decline, institutional anxiety, faith and leadership, pastors and ministry leaders, Future Christian Podcast

In this episode of the Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr. talks with pastor and writer Tara Beth Leach about the growing online ecosystem where deconstruction is monetized, anger is rewarded, and discipleship is often replaced by endless dismantling.

Tara Beth shares why she believes some deconstruction is necessary (especially as faith matures), but warns that deconstruction without reconstruction can become a spiral that forms people in cynicism rather than hope. She describes how churches can respond to cultural crises without becoming “statement churches,” why partisan politics becomes idolatrous, and how practices like liturgy and theology formation can subvert polarization and re-form the Christian imagination.

• Why online deconstruction and local church reality are often very different

• The danger of mistaking deconstruction for discipleship

• How algorithms reward outrage and shape Christian formation

• Why Gen Z is often hungry for embodied, communal faith

• Liturgy and slow formation as a pastoral response in a divided age

• The difference between charisma and character—and what churches celebrate

• Supporting women in ministry: why men often “call out” people who look like them

• Tara Beth’s “G.R.E.A.T.” morning prayer practice and her book The Great Morning Revolution

Tara Beth Leach is a pastor, preacher of the Word, and writer. She speaks widely at conferences, retreats, and universities across the country on Women in Ministry, Church Leadership, and the call to be a Radiant Witness. She is the Senior Pastor at Good Shepherd Church in Naperville, IL and previously served at Christ Church in Oakbrook and as Senior Pastor of First Church of the Nazarene of Pasadena (”PazNaz”) in SoCal. She is a graduate of Olivet Nazarene University and Northern Theological Seminary and has authored three books, including Emboldened and Radiant Church. Tara Beth is the co-founder of Propel Ecclesia and is also the co-host of The Pastors Table podcast. She has two beautiful and rambunctious sons and has been married to the love of her life, Jeff, since 2006.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Find Tara online @TaraBethLeach

🟧 Tara's Substack: https://substack.com/@tarabethleach

🌐 Tara's  Website: https://tarabethleach.com/

🎧 Tara's Podcast: The Pastors Table Podcast

📖 Tara's Book: The Great Morning Revolution

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

SEO / Keywords

Tara Beth Leach, deconstruction, discipleship, church hurt, Christian formation, Gen Z church, Christian nationalism, partisan politics idolatry, pastoral leadership, preaching in a divided age, liturgy, school of theology, Christian imagination, cancel culture, call-out culture, family systems theory, Jonathan Haidt Anxious Generation, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr.

In this episode, Loren interviews Jason Hanselman, Donor Relations Director and longtime pastor, missionary, church planter, and fundraiser. Jason shares why asking people for money is, surprisingly, one of his most deeply spiritual practices, and why churches must rethink the way they talk about giving if they want to cultivate generosity rather than anxiety.

Together they explore:

• Why asking for money can be a spiritual experience for donors and leaders

• How childhood experiences shape our money scripts

• Why guilt-based “money talks” cause people to disengage

• How nonprofits have shifted donor expectations—and why churches must catch up

• How to make giving personal, relational, and meaningful

• Why younger adults don’t lack commitment—they lack invitation and clarity

• How segmenting, storytelling, and vision casting can transform a giving culture

• Why many churches need to simplify their structures, clarify their mission, and make compelling asks

• How capital campaigns can tie internal needs to external impact

Jason offers honest, practical, field-tested wisdom for pastors, stewardship teams, and anyone responsible for raising money in a ministry context. If you want to cultivate a healthier, more joyful, more spiritually grounded approach to giving, this conversation will give you the tools to start.

Jason Hanselman currently serves as a Donor Relations Director with Mission Aviation Fellowship. His ministry experience spans more than 25 years. He has led in a variety of capacities in kingdom-building roles as a pastor, missionary, church planter and fundraiser. Jason was born and raised in Denver Colorado where he met his wife Mary - they’ve been married for 32 years. He holds a Bachelor’s degree in Ministry and a Master of Arts degree in Education. Jason’s goal is to partner with other Kingdom minded individuals and churches to raise enough resources to make it possible for them to fund their vision and increase their impact. Jason enjoys spending time with his family on hikes and in art museums. Jason and Mary raised their three children in Boise, Idaho: Naomi (25), Grace (23) and Solomon (20). When he has extra time, Jason is a portrait artist and an avid sports fan.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Jason's Website: https://fundyourvision.my.canva.site/

📧 Jason's Email: jasonfyv@gmail.com

🎧 Podcast Episodes Referenced: Sheryl Johnson

🎧 Podcast Episodes Referenced: JJ Peterson

🎧 Podcast Episodes Referenced: Mike Cosper

🎧 Podcast Episodes Referenced: Michelle Van Loon

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

SEO / Keywords

church fundraising, generosity, stewardship campaign, donor relations, spiritual fundraising, money and faith, church giving, nonprofit fundraising strategies, Mission Aviation Fellowship, fundraising without guilt, money scripts, younger donors church, capital campaign ideas, storytelling for churches, Loren Richmond Jr, Future Christian Podcast

In this in-person episode recorded at Broomfield United Methodist Church, host Loren Richmond Jr. sits down with longtime student ministries director Mike Orr to talk about faith formation, Gen Z and Gen Alpha, belonging, spiritual maturity, and what it really means to cultivate community in a post-Christian culture.

With warmth, honesty, and decades of ministry experience, Mike reflects on:

• His early spiritual experiences and how actual transformation — not willpower — shaped his faith.

• The surprising power of belonging-first ministry for Gen Z & Gen Alpha.

• Why emotionally coercive youth ministry of the 90s left deep marks — and how churches can do better.

• How to hold space for students with radically different political or cultural views.

• Why youth ministry should never be about indoctrination, but about helping young people own and explore their faith.

• How to handle deconstruction as a natural part of spiritual growth.

• The crisis facing young men — and how to model a healthier version of Christian masculinity.

• Why the future of church isn't about producing spiritual “products,” but creating a context where real faith can flourish.

• The essential role parents play in forming faith, whether they realize it or not.

• His hope for Christianity: “Keep adding leaves to the table. There’s room for everyone.”

This is a rich, grounded conversation about what actually works in youth ministry today — and what kind of church the next generation is longing for.

Mike Orr has been a youth worker since the late 1990's, serving churches in Pennsylvania, Connecticut, California, and Colorado. He earned his MDiv from Fuller Theological Seminary in Pasadena, California. For over 10 years he has been the Director of Student Ministries at Broomfield United Methodist Church, located in the northern suburbs of Denver, CO. He lives with his wife and 3 dogs in Denver, CO. He has written zero books. 

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Mike's Church: Broomfield UMC

🎧 Podcast Episodes Referenced: Andrew Root

🎧 Podcast Episodes Referenced: Quiet Revival

🎧 Mike’s Podcast: Tapestry Talk

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

youth ministry, Gen Z faith, Gen Alpha spirituality, belonging in church, student ministries, Mike Orr Broomfield UMC, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr, deconstruction and faith, progressive youth ministry, family faith formation, modern youth ministry challenges, Charlie Kirk Christianity, masculinity and church, spiritual formation for teens, church and political identity, Christian nationalism youth, Wesleyan sanctification, teen mental health church

In this episode of the Future Christian Podcast, host Martha Tatarnic speaks with Archbishop Shane Parker, the newly elected Primate of the Anglican Church of Canada, about leading through transition, discernment, and hope for the church’s future.

Archbishop Parker shares the story of his unexpected election, reflecting on themes of surrender, vocation, and guiding change rather than being changed by circumstance. Together, they explore what it means to lead faithfully in a post-Christian context—one where the church no longer holds cultural prominence but still holds deep spiritual purpose.

They discuss:

• The evolving role of Christianity in Canadian society

• What it means to be “first among equals” in Anglican leadership

• The spiritual practice of personal prayer and community intercession

• Why some leaders are called to stay instead of move on

• The challenge of guiding change before it overtakes the church

• How to reimagine church structures for relevance and sustainability

• The importance of friendship, pastoral care, and gathered community in thriving congregations

• His hope that the future of Christianity will embody the courage, compassion, and justice of Christ

Parker offers both realism and hope: that the Anglican Church can rediscover its vitality by focusing on community, worship, and service — not nostalgia or institutional weight.

Archbishop Shane Parker was elected the 15th Primate of the Anglican Church of Canada on June 26, 2025, and installed on June 29, 2025, at St. Paul’s Cathedral in London, Ontario. Prior to being elected Primate, he had served as the Bishop of the Anglican Diocese of Ottawa since 2020. Before that, he was dean of the Diocese of Ottawa and rector of Christ Church Cathedral for two decades. Born to Irish parents in Edmonton, Alberta, he grew up in western Canada. He worked as a labourer for several years before embarking on undergraduate and graduate studies in sociology at Carleton University. After working as a professional sociologist, he studied theology at Saint Paul University. He was ordained as a priest in 1987 in the Diocese of Ottawa, later serving as the diocesan archdeacon.  Parker has an honorary doctorate from Saint Paul University, where he has served as a part-time professor of pastoral ministry and chairs its Anglican Studies Advisory Committee. A collection of his pastoral essays was published by Novalis in a book called Answering the Big Questions. He is a recipient of the Interfaith Ottawa Award, for devoted service to promoting interfaith dialogue and cooperation. Parker is married to Katherine Shadbolt, a lawyer specializing in family law and mediation. He has three adult children and three grandchildren. He is handy, enjoys physical work and is most comfortable in natural places.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 The Anglican Church of Canada: https://www.anglican.ca/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this heartfelt episode, Loren Richmond Jr. speaks with Rev. Dr. Angela Williams Gorrell, theologian, researcher, and author of Braving Difficult Decisions: What to Do When You Don’t Know What to Do and Always On: The Gravity of Joy. Drawing from her own experience of profound grief and transformation, Angela shares how surrender, acceptance, and spiritual practices like meditation can open us to God’s presence—even in silence.

Together, they explore:

• The difference between grasping for control and living in surrender

• How to accept reality as it is without losing hope

• Why prayer isn’t preparation for action—it is action

• Learning from feelings as information, not final truth

• What it means to trust that nothing is wasted in God’s economy

• How pastors and church leaders can find peace and purpose amid decline or loss

• Why healing and joy are still possible, even after tragedy

Whether you’re navigating personal loss or leading through uncertainty in ministry, this conversation offers honesty, theological depth, and hard-won wisdom for finding grace when life doesn’t go according to plan.

Rev. Dr. Angela Williams Gorrell is a speaker, author, and consultant. She has taught at several schools including Yale and Baylor University. Media sources such as the New York Times, NPR, and the Washington Post have highlighted her research. Dr. Angela is the author of always on, The Gravity of Joy, and a new book, Braving Difficult Decisions: What to Do When You Don’t Know What to Do. She’d love to connect with you on Facebook or Instagram @angelagorrell

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Her website: https://www.angelagorrell.com/

📱 Her socials: @angelagorrell

📖 Her book: Braving Difficult Decisions

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Heather Thompson Day

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Martha Tatarnic

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Angela Williams Gorrell, Braving Difficult Decisions, Always On The Gravity of Joy, Future Christian Podcast, Loren Richmond Jr., Christian leadership, spiritual direction, surrender to God, prayer and healing, faith through suffering, meditation and Christian spirituality, grief and resilience, trauma and faith, pastoral care, nothing wasted in God’s economy, mainline church leadership, church decline and hope, progressive Christian spirituality

In this roundtable episode of the Future Christian Podcast, host Martha Tatarnic is joined by Loren Richmond Jr., Dennis Sanders, and David Emery for a deep conversation on the past, present, and future of the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). Together they wrestle with what “No Creed but Christ” means today—and how this historic movement can renew its theological identity in a rapidly changing culture.

This conversation explores:

• Why “No creed but Christ” was once revolutionary—and what it might mean now

• How Disciples’ emphasis on inclusion and open communion can recover deeper theological grounding

• The tension between progressive activism and theological clarity

• The role of preaching, formation, and leadership in shaping discipleship

• Why local churches—and not denominational structures—are key to renewal

• Signs of hope and new life emerging in Disciples congregations across North America

If you’ve ever wondered how denominations can stay rooted in the Gospel while adapting to modern realities, this episode offers an honest, hopeful look at faithful innovation and renewal in the mainline church.

Dennis Sanders is an ordained Disciples of Christ minister and lead pastor of First Christian Church in St. Paul, Minnesota.  A native of Flint, Michigan and big fan of the Detroit Tigers and Lions, Dennis is also a communications specialist for a Lutheran congregation in the Twin Cities and is the host of the Church and Main podcast, which tries to live out Karl Barth’s quote of reading the Bible and the newspaper and interpreting the news through the Bible.  Dennis lives in Minneapolis with his husband Daniel and their cats.

David Emery is the Lead Pastor of Harvard Avenue Christian Church in Tulsa, OK. David is a passionate preacher, compassionate pastor, and adept leader whose understanding of the Gospel and vision for the church help our congregation fulfill our mission to live and love like Jesus. David has a reputation for growing churches, reaching new people, and transforming lives in every church he has served throughout his ministry, which includes congregations in Arkansas, Texas, and Kentucky. He holds a Master’s of Divinity from Vanderbilt. If you were to ask David what his favorite scripture passage is, he would tell you: “Whatever I’m preaching on this week!” An avid runner and multiple-marathoner, when David isn’t on the trail or in the pulpit, he enjoys spending time with his wife, Teresa, and their children and grandchildren.

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Dennis' Church: https://fccsaintpaul.org/

🌐 David's Church: https://hacctulsa.org/

📖 Book Referenced: Thriving Church

🎧 Dennis Sanders Podcast: Church and Main

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Former Anglican priest Brian E. Pearson joins host Martha Tatarnic on the Future Christian Podcast to discuss his book Talking to the Trees: A Journey Into Soul and his evolving spirituality after nearly forty years in ordained ministry.

In this deeply honest conversation, Brian reflects on his transition from parish life to life on the edges—where faith, doubt, nature, and imagination meet. Together, he and Martha explore what it means to live faith large rather than small, to follow curiosity and courage beyond institutional boundaries, and to discover the sacred in unexpected places.

They talk about:

• Why the edges of faith are often where renewal begins

• The cost and gift of leaving the institutional church

• How nature, ritual, and imagination can nurture a living spirituality

• Storytelling as a pathway to truth and healing

• Courage, curiosity, and the call to live with openness instead of fear

Pearson’s journey invites pastors, seekers, and skeptics alike to consider: What if leaving the church isn’t an ending, but another way of following the Spirit into new life?

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Website: https://www.brianepearson.ca/

📖 His Book: Talking to Trees

🎧 His Podcast: The Mystic Cave

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode of the Future Christian Podcast, host Loren Richmond Jr. speaks with Rev. Dr. Sheryl Johnson, theologian, ethicist, and author of Serving Money, Serving God: Aligning Radical Justice, Christian Practice, and Church Life (Fortress Press, 2023). Together they explore how churches can move beyond good intentions to embody justice through everyday practices—especially around finance, fundraising, stewardship, and administration.

They discuss:

• Why church administration is theological, not just logistical

• How job postings and pay scales reveal a congregation’s real values

• The pitfalls of donor-centered fundraising and better alternatives

• Honest communication about money, failure, and hope

• How churches can make ethical decisions about property and buildings

• What it means to see the local church as a foretaste of God’s reign

Sheryl challenges pastors and leaders to re-imagine what “faithful stewardship” truly means in today’s world—where economic justice, transparency, and collaboration are essential for credible ministry.

Sheryl Johnson (she/her) is a settler on Ohlone land and was born in Treaty 1 Territory in what is colonially known as Winnipeg, Canada. She began teaching at Pacific Lutheran Theological Seminary in the fall of 2020, as she was defending her PhD in Theology and Ethics at Graduate Theological Union. Her dissertation focused on the intersections of social justice (racial, economic, gender, etc) and ecclesial practices (specifically stewardship, finance, and polity). A book based on her dissertation, Serving Money, Serving God:  Aligning Radical Justice, Christian Practice, and Church Life, was published by Fortress Press in 2023. Sheryl is an ordained minister in the United Church of Canada, with dual standing in the United Church of Christ. Sheryl has served several congregations, campus ministries, ecumenical advocacy organizations (especially KAIROS: Canadian Ecumenical Justice Initiatives and the Student Christian Movement/World Student Christian Federation), and global church partners (specifically the National Council of Churches of the Philippines and People's Action Forum in Zambia), in addition to her academic work. She completed her M.Div and MPS degrees at Emmanuel College, University of Toronto and also completed a Certificate of Specialization in Theology and Ecology at the University of St. Michael's College during her theological studies. Sheryl is passionate about embodied, participatory, and critical pedagogies and supporting students to make connections between justice commitments and vocational practices. 

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Website: https://www.sheryljohnsonphd.com/

📖 Her Book: https://www.fortresspress.com/store/product/9781506482965/Serving-Money-Serving-God

📖 Her Next Book: The Business of God

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Michelle Van Loon

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode of the Future Christian Podcast, host Loren Richmond Jr. talks with author Michelle Van Loon, whose new book Downsizing: Letting Go of Evangelicalism’s Non-Essentials explores the story of evangelical faith from its post–World War II roots to today’s crisis of credibility.

Drawing from her own journey—from a secular Jewish upbringing to decades inside evangelical churches—Van Loon offers an unflinching yet hopeful look at the movement’s excesses, blind spots, and spiritual gifts worth preserving.

Together, Loren and Michelle unpack:

• The distinction between revival and revivalism—and why chasing emotional “mountaintop” moments misses the point.

• The long shadow of leaders like James Dobson and Bill Gothard, and how their influence shaped evangelical culture.

• The roots of authoritarianism and control in religious systems—and what healthy spiritual authority looks like.

• Why humility and listening matter more than programs or platforms.

• What it means to “downsize” faith while still holding on to Jesus.

Van Loon reminds listeners that faith is not about clinging to institutions but about rediscovering the way of Christ—one marked by honesty, empathy, and hope.

👉 Subscribe to the Future Christian Podcast for more honest conversations about leadership, theology, and the future of the church.

Michelle Van Loon’s writing is shaped by her deeply rooted faith in Christ, secular Jewish heritage, spiritual hunger, and storyteller’s sensibilities. She has been a regular contributor to Christianity Today magazine, and has articles at a number of other digital sites.. Her eight books include her newest, Downsizing: Letting Go of Evangelicalism's Nonessentials. You can learn more about her work at her website, michellevanloon.com or connect with her at her little corner of Substack, which is called Transforming Words. 

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Website: michellevanloon.com 

📖 Her Book:: https://www.eerdmans.com/9780802884626/downsizing/

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Joelle Kidd

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Robert Schuller

🎧 Episodes Referenced: J. Michael Jordan

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Mike Cosper

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this special roundtable episode of the Future Christian Podcast, host Loren Richmond Jr. welcomes a panel of seasoned clergy leaders: Rev. Tabatha Johnson (Disciples of Christ), The Venerable Sheila Van Zandwyck (Anglican), Rev. Canon Katherine Morgan (Anglican), and Rev. Canon Martha Tatarnic (Anglican and Future Christian co-host).

Together, they share candid stories about their call to ministry, navigating representation and authority, the sacrifices women often make that men may not, and how mentors and allies have helped along the way. From maternity leave struggles to stereotypes about “what a minister should look like,” these leaders open up about both progress and persistent challenges for women in the church today.

Listeners will gain insights into:

• How women discern and embrace a call to ordained ministry.

• The “stained glass ceiling” and ongoing equity issues in church leadership.

• The importance of mentors, representation, and visible role models.

• How congregations respond differently to women clergy across traditions.

• What gives hope for the next generation of women entering ministry.

Whether you’re a pastor, church leader, or layperson passionate about equality in the church, this episode offers wisdom, encouragement, and a vision for a more inclusive future.

Rev. Tabatha D. Johnson is a pastor in the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ).  She has served as a pastor and chaplain for over twenty years. She graduated from the University of Missouri-Kansas City and Central Baptist Theological Seminary and is co-editor and contributor to Still A Mother: Journeys Through Perinatal Bereavement (Judson Press.) a 2017 Gold Medal Winner in the Illumination Book Awards. She is currently the Senior Pastor at Shawnee Community Christian Church where she joyfully serves alongside people who love Jesus and one another. Tabatha’s greatest love, besides her family and her church, are coffee and starting home improvement projects in her home that someday, hopefully, she will finish. Tabatha lives with her spouse, Cory, and their children in the Kansas City Metro.

The Venerable Sheila Van Zandwyk is Archdeacon of Lincoln Deanery and Rector of Church of the Transfiguration. She was born and raised in St. Catharines and was raised in the Christian Reformed Church. She began attending an Anglican Church in my twenties. Until starting seminary at 40, Van Zandwyk worked in retail, for a number of years as the Manager of a Shoppers Drug Mart. Ordained for 17 years, Van Zandwyk has worked in churches in Oakville, Hamilton and now St. Catharines, being at Transfiguration for 6 years now. 

The Reverend Canon Katherine Morgan graduated with a Master of Divinity from Trinity College, University of Toronto. Morgan is ordained in the Diocese of Niagara where she had the privilege of serving in rural, small town and city parishes for 29 years.  Currently Morgan is the rector of Church of the Resurrection in Hamilton. In her free time, she loves to sing, enjoy puzzles, and is the proud parent of an adult son. 

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Website: https://shawneecommunity.org/

🌐 Website: 

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Margo Guernsey

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Key points from the conversation:

• How spiritual practices can function like a “gym for your soul”

• Why institutions resist technology and why that must change

• The difference between innovation within old systems and creating new ones

• Why small congregations can thrive by embracing sustainability, not size

• How the church can learn from entrepreneurship, social enterprise, and start-up culture

Cathie Caimano, ʻFr. Cathie’, and is an Episcopal priest, ordained for 25 years. Since 2016, She's been a  Free Range Priest - her own ministry/business with a mission to help reimagine ministry in the 21st century. She serves a small congregation in a 'cage free' way, and she writes, coaches, teaches and consults about practical ways of being and doing church in sustainable, faithful, joyful ways. She lives near Charlotte, NC with her wonderful husband and adorable Great Dane. When she's not thinking about God and church, you can find her taking photos of the sunrise, or out running somewhere!

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Website: https://trexo.church/p/start-here

🌐 Website: https://www.freerangepriest.org/about

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Chad Brooks

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Steve Cuss

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Matt Syrdal

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Bethany Peerbolte

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this conversation you’ll hear:

• Why numerical growth has become an idol in many churches

• The crushing accumulation of roles and expectations placed on clergy

• Four dimensions of transformation—intellectual, psychic, moral, and religious—that shape Christian life

• Why congregations need to clarify identity, mission, and resources instead of trying to be “all things to all people”

• How gospel vision statements can help churches focus on what really matters

The Rev. Dr. William (Bill) Harrison is president of Lutheran Theological Seminary, Saskatoon, and former chair of the Saskatoon Theological Union Common Faculty. Bill teaches systematic and historical theology, and ethics. In addition to his PhD in systematic theology and church history from Boston College, Bill has degrees in English literature (M.A.), theology (B.Th.), and political science (B.A. Hons). Bill is the author of Leadership in a Shrinking Church: Finding New Vision in Unlikely Places; Frequently Asked Questions in Christian Theology; and In Praise of Mixed Religions: The Syncretism Solution in a Multifaith World. Everywhere he goes, Bill takes music with him, listening to a broad variety. At home, he spends as much time as possible walking trails or out in his kayak.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Get his Book: Leadership in a Shrinking Church

📱 Follow: https://www.facebook.com/bill.harrison.359128

🌐 Website: www.lutherantheological.ca 

🌐 Website: https://www.facebook.com/LTSSaskatoon/

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Robert Schuller episode

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Free Range Priest Helping clergy and congregations reimagine ministry in the digital age. 

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Key Points:

• Why size doesn’t determine health—and how small churches can thrive

• The four stages of congregational life: unstable, stable, vital, and sustainable

• How to right-size ministries instead of copying “the big church down the street”

• Why tracking data isn’t impersonal but essential to caring for people

• The difference between mercy, justice, mission, and evangelism—and why churches must reclaim their distinct call

• How COVID acted as a “reset button” for many congregations

Chad Brooks is an ordained elder in the United Methodist Church and currently serves on the staff of The Louisiana Annual Conference of the United Methodist Church as the Congregational Vitality Strategist. He lives in central Louisiana with his wife of 20 years Meredith. Chad is a graduate of Louisiana Tech University and Asbury Theological Seminary. Chad grew up in the church as the son of an SBC Pastor and has spent his career working in all aspects of church, from Technical Production Director of churches and a major Seminary, to a pastor of established churches and church plants. He has stewarded the Productive Pastor Community for 20 years and it equally passionate about seeing revival as he is about resourcing Pastors in all aspects of healthy ministry. When not reading and thinking about the Church, he enjoys practicing Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and being in the outdoors at his hunting camp.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Get his Book: Is My Church Healthy?

🌐 Louisiana Conference: https://www.la-umc.org/conferencestaff

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Dennis Sanders

🎧 Episodes Referenced: Drew Crowson

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Listeners will hear:

• Why “battles are inevitable, and preparation must be intentional”

• How to discern between authenticity and “bleeding on the people”

• The danger of over-spiritualizing crises—and how leaders can own responsibility

• Bishop Dudley’s vulnerable reflections on suicidal ideation and the hope that carried him through

• Why he insists, “You are not what you feel”

Dr. Geoffrey V. Dudley, Sr. is a retired Air Force Chaplain (Lt. Colonel), Bishop, author, and leadership coach. A lifelong minister and visionary leader, he holds a PhD in Organizational Leadership from Regent University, a Doctor of Ministry from Virginia Union University, a Master of Divinity from Virginia Union, a Master of Human Relations from the University of Oklahoma, and a Bachelor of Arts in Communication, Drama & Speech from UNC Greensboro. He also holds a Post-Master Education Specialist degree from the University of Memphis. Dr. Dudley is the founding pastor of New Life in Christ Church (O'Fallon, IL), one of the fastest-growing churches in the St. Louis metro area, and the CEO of New Life Community Development Corporation, which leads major community initiatives including a $20M affordable housing project. A John Maxwell Associate Trainer and author of six books—including Leading Through Storms—he also mentors leaders through iLeadAcademy.net and Changing Lives Ministries. He and his wife Glenda have two adult children engaged in ministry and nonprofit leadership.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 His Book: https://ivpress.com/leading-through-storms

🌐 His church website: https://www.nlicic.org

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics include:

• Why belonging must come before believing for new generations

• How Bedford House embodies Phillips Seminary’s commitment to inclusion

• The challenges and opportunities of rural and small-church ministry

• Alternative pathways into ministry beyond the traditional M.Div.

• Why theological education must adapt without losing its core formation

• The role of social justice engagement in calling new leaders

• Dr. Powe’s hopes for the church in an age of disruption and division

Rev. F. Douglas Powe Jr., PhD is President of Phillips Theological Seminary in Tulsa, Okla., where he leads the seminary in its work toward deep learning, faithful leadership and global impact. An ordained elder in The United Methodist Church, Dr. Powe is a respected scholar, teacher, and author whose work explores congregational vitality, urban ministry, and innovative approaches to evangelism. Before leading Phillips, he served as Director of the Lewis Center for Church Leadership and James C. Logan Professor of Evangelism at Wesley Theological Seminary. His books include Sustaining While Disrupting, The Adept Church, and Transforming Evangelism. A graduate of Ohio Wesleyan University, Emory University’s Candler School of Theology, and Emory’s Graduate Division of Religion, Dr. Powe is widely sought after for his insights on faith, leadership, and the changing ministry environment.

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Book: https://www.cokesbury.com/The-Adept-Church?vsl=2487

📖 Book: https://www.fortresspress.com/store/product/9781506479200/Sustaining-While-Disrupting

🌐 Phillps Seminary: https://ptstulsa.edu/

🎧 Past Episode with Doug Powe: Sustaining While Disrupting

🎧 Past Episode with Doug Powe: The Adept Church

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics include:

• Why integrity, not charisma, is essential for church leadership

• The difference between protecting a church’s brand and serving the people of God

• The “tripod of relational safety”: safe self, safe community, and safe ministry

• Distinguishing between guilt and shame, and how each shapes spiritual formation

• Why forgiveness does not always mean reconciliation

• Practical first steps churches can take toward safeguarding

Taylor Patterson is an instructor in the counseling department at Regent University. She worked for several years as a mental health counselor at a nonprofit agency serving survivors of domestic violence, sexual assault, and human trafficking and now sees clients in private practice, specializing in adult with a history of childhood trauma. She served as co-editor for "Safeguarding Skills: A Guide to Preventing Abuse and Fostering Healing in the Church,” a textbook for seminaries, parachurch ministries, and local churches, and has published in peer-reviewed journals. Taylor’s research interests include interpersonal violence, compassion fatigue prevention and treatment, and trauma-informed counselor education and supervision.

Dr. Lisa Compton is an Associate Professor and Director of the Ph.D. in Counselor Education program at Regent University. With over 29 years of experience in the mental health field, she is a licensed clinical social worker (LCSW), certified trauma treatment specialist (CTTS), and compassion fatigue educator (CFE). Dr. Compton has been a conference keynote speaker, presented internationally on trauma-related topics, and has been featured on CBN News discussing domestic violence and sexual trauma. She is the co-author of Preparing for Trauma Work in Clinical Mental Health and Safeguarding Skills: A Guide to Preventing Abuse and Fostering Healing in the Church. Her research focuses on secondary trauma and trauma pedagogy with numerous published articles, including "Absorption Vulnerability" in Traumatology (2024).

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Their book: https://www.ivpress.com/skills-for-safeguarding

🌐 Lisa's Website: https://drlisacompton.com/

🎧 Mike Cosper on the Dangers of Ideology in Church

🎧 May Young on Biblical Lament  

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

The conversation also moves beyond denominational borders—raising questions relevant to mainline and evangelical contexts alike:

• How should denominations engage in political advocacy when their cultural influence has waned?

• What would it take to be truly inclusive of conservative, moderate, and progressive voices?

• Where might revival come from—and how will we know it when we see it?

Dennis Sanders is an ordained Disciples of Christ minister and lead pastor of First Christian Church in St. Paul, Minnesota.  A native of Flint, Michigan and big fan of the Detroit Tigers and Lions, Dennis is also a communications specialist for a Lutheran congregation in the Twin Cities and is the host of the Church and Main podcast, which tries to live out Karl Barth’s quote of reading the Bible and the newspaper and interpreting the news through the Bible.  Dennis lives in Minneapolis with his husband Daniel and their cats.

Mentioned Resources:

🎧 Last GA Episode with Dennis: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-fgenv-1476ff7

📱 Dennis instagram: @adventcelina

📖 Mixed Ecology Book: https://www.churchpublishing.org/embracingthemixedecology

🌐 Ben Crosby's Substack: https://substack.com/@bencrosby

🌐 Jeff Gill's Substack: https://substack.com/@knapsack

🎧 Dennis Sanders: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-q2e35-134587d

🎧 Church and Main Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/church-and-main/id1660817140

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

They discuss:

• Why liturgy and the Book of Common Prayer resonate with non-liturgical Christians

• How to plant a church in a mainline denomination with little recent church-planting history

• Balancing entrepreneurial hustle with slow, patient spiritual formation

• The importance of pastoral boundaries for family health

• Building a prayer team and cultivating resilience in ministry

Drew Crowson is a church planter in the Episcopal Diocese of Dallas. Before stepping into church planting, he served in young adult and youth ministry in diverse contexts—from Dallas to Düsseldorf, Germany, an oil compound in the Middle East, and Auburn, Alabama. Deeply shaped by the early 2000s emergent church movement, his journey ultimately led him deeper into Jesus and into the Anglican tradition. Drew is married to an incredible woman, and together they are raising three young children who daily remind them of their ongoing need for grace.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Celina instagram: @adventcelina

🌐 Drew's Substack: https://substack.com/@andrewcrowson

🌐 WashPark UMC: https://www.washparkumc.org

Other Church planting episodes:

🎧 Cameron Trimble: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-8siub-10d0a4d

🎧 Paula Stone Williams: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-pgxda-f59f19

🎧 Tim Morey: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-25zwi-1059d6d

🎧 Nick Warnes: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-ketw5-1172f9e

🎧 Jonah Overton: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-y28bz-13457f4

🎧 Even More: https://www.podbean.com/ep/pb-wzbs7-173f5fc

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics Covered:

• What “Christian pop culture” really means and how it shaped Joelle’s youth

• The collision of capitalism, conservatism, and evangelical media

• How shame, purity culture, and literalist theology distort identity and faith

• The rise of Christian influencers, tradwives, and mega-pastor empires

• What the church can do differently—especially for young people today

Joelle Kidd is a writer, award-winning journalist, and editor who lives in a book-filled basement apartment in Tkaronto/Toronto. Her work has appeared in outlets such as The Walrus, This Magazine, Lit Hub, The Rumpus, and Xtra Magazine. She holds an MFA in creative writing from the University of Guelph. Jesusland is her first book.     

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Follow https://bsky.app/profile/joellekidd.bsky.social).

🌐 Website: https://joellekidd.com/ 

🎧 Mike Cosper: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-2m9ra-176f33e 

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics Covered

• The rise and fall of Robert Schuller and the Crystal Cathedral

• Why Schuller’s legacy lives on in today’s church growth models

• How capitalism and faith became intertwined in modern ministry

• The unintended consequences of constant innovation

• Schuller’s surprising theological conservatism and deep pastoral care

• What “resonance” offers as a response to cultural acceleration

Mark T. Mulder is Professor of Sociology at Calvin University and director of the Common Good Collective. He is the author or co-author of five books In addition, Mulder has published numerous peer-reviewed articles in academic journals, including Social Problems, Religion and American Culture, and The Journal of Urban History. He has also published pieces for church audiences and won writing awards from the Evangelical Press Association and the Associated Church Press. 

Gerardo Martí is William R. Kenan, Jr. Professor of Sociology at Davidson College and president of the Society for the Scientific Study of Religion. A prolific and award winning author, his research explores religious innovation and the role of religion in shaping patterns of racialization and political engagement in the United States. Bluesky ‪@gerardomarti.bsky.social

Mentioned Resources:

🌐 Faculty Website: https://calvin.edu/people/mark-mulder

🌐 Faculty Website: https://www.davidson.edu/people/gerardo-marti

📖  Previous Book: https://www.rutgersuniversitypress.org/the-glass-church/9780813589060/

📖  The Book: https://www.eerdmans.com/9780802878557/the-church-must-grow-or-perish/

🎧 Andrew Root: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/walking-into-sorrow-andrew-root-on-evangelism-in-the-age-of-despair/

🎧 Andrew Root: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/andy-root/

🎧 Andrew Root: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-jtzdu-1500e5e

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics Covered

• The spiritual needs of middle age (and why churches often overlook them)

• How grief, caregiving, and loss shape our faith

• What sustains ministry over the long haul

• Changing theological priorities after seminary

• Parenting teenagers and modeling faith without coercion

• Embracing mystery, awe, and the Spirit’s leading

Mentioned Resources:

📖  Martha's Book: https://www.churchpublishing.org/whygather

📖  James Cone: https://orbisbooks.com/products/the-cross-and-the-lynching-tree

🎧 Andrew Root: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/walking-into-sorrow-andrew-root-on-evangelism-in-the-age-of-despair/

🎧 Arianna Molloy: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/healthy-calling-ariana-malloy-on-burnout-purpose-and-redefining-work/

🎧 Elizabeth Schrader Polczer: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/elizabeth-schrader-polczer-on-rethinking-mary-magdalene-part-1/

🎧 Suzanne Nadell: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/leading-with-grace-suzanne-nadell-on-navigating-faith-media-polarization/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

They discuss:

• Why sorrow is "contagious"—and why that matters

• The mystical, communal nature of consolation

• How pastors and chaplains might be better theologians than academics

• What happens when a society loses its rituals for goodbye

• Why people turn to the occult when meaning is missing

Whether you’re a ministry leader, chaplain, or spiritually curious, this episode will help you rethink what it means to offer hope in a world hungry for presence, not platitudes.

Andrew Root is the Carrie Olson Baalson professor of youth and family ministry at Luther Seminary in St. Paul, Minnesota. He writes and researches in areas of theology, ministry, culture and younger generations.  His recent books are Churches and the Crisis of Decline, When Church Stops Working, and The Church After Innovation. Andy has worked in congregations, parachurch ministries, and social service programs. He lives in St. Paul with his wife Kara, two children, Owen and Maisy, and their dog. When not reading, writing, or teaching, Andy spends far too much time watching TV and movies.

Mentioned Resources:

📖  Book: https://bakerpublishinggroup.com/books/evangelism-in-an-age-of-despair/423470

🌐 Website: https://www.andrewroot.org

🎧 Previous Episode: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/andy-root/

🎧 Previous Episode: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-jtzdu-1500e5e

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Together they explore:

• The shift away from traditional seminary students to older, working adults

• The growing presence of women in seminary—and the challenges they still face

• Creative cohort-based and hybrid models that foster both learning and community

• The need for deeper church-seminary partnerships and real-time ministry formation

• Stackable certificates, lay education, and the future of non-traditional theological training

• Why poor digital presence is a turnoff—and how seminaries can adapt

Bekah Buchterkirchen is a writer, speaker, and creative collaborator passionate about cultivating joy and faith in every season. With nearly a decade in Christian higher education and ministry alongside her pastor-husband, she seeks to create spaces where curiosity, hospitality, and the love of Jesus meet. She lives in the Pacific Northwest with their two, almost three, young kids and writes to encourage moms in the trenches of motherhood to seek the Lord daily—even when they feel like it's not enough.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Follow @bekahbuck

🌐 Website: https://www.bekahbuck.com

🎧 Arianna Malloy: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-gb5yr-18a44c5

🎧 John Hawthorne: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-zgqq8-18c307a   

🎧 Ulysses Allen: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-iumm4-1502da4

🎧 Ted Smith: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-w4nrb-15d747b

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics explored:

• Why biblical lament is more than venting—it's rooted in God’s character and promises

• How lament helps churches stand with the suffering and resist apathy

• Why modern worship often skips lament, and why that’s a problem

• How unprocessed pain from the COVID era may still be shaping us

• The difference between stoic acceptance and faithful sorrow

• What it means to trust God when healing or justice may not come on our timeline

May Young (PhD, Trinity Evangelical Divinity School) is associate professor of biblical studies and chairs the Department of Biblical Studies, Christian Ministries, Intercultural Studies, and Philosophy at Taylor University. She has contributed to several volumes focused on lament, including Reading the Psalms Theologically (Lexham) and World Christianity and COVID-19: Discourses and Perspective (Routledge). She is a member of the Evangelical Theological Society and the Society of Biblical Literature and serves on the board of directors of the Institute of Biblical Research, as well as the editorial board for Sacred Roots.

Mentioned Resources:

📖  May Young's book: https://www.ivpress.com/walking-with-god-through-the-valley

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

• Margo’s journey from UCC upbringing to filmmaking as spiritual practice

• The groundbreaking ordination of the Philadelphia Eleven

• Why solidarity, trust, and long-term relationship-building matter

• The cost of truth-telling and challenging church hierarchy

• Representation, visibility, and the power of embodied leadership

• The importance of storytelling in shaping faith and future

• How churches can resist silence and engage with courage

• Hosting a screening and engaging your community with the film

Margo Guernsey (she/her) is a documentary Director/Producer, impact strategist, and founder of Time Travel Productions LLC. Her films include Councilwoman (America ReFramed 2019), No Time To Fail (America Reframed 2023), The Philadelphia Eleven (impact distribution 2023 - 2024 topping 500 screenings, American Public Television 2025), and THE OFFICIALS (TIME Studios, 2024). Prior to film, Margo worked as a union organizer, non-profit development director, and Spanish/English translator. Margo’s work has received support from Chicken & Egg Pictures, ITVS, Catapult Film Fund, GoodPitch, Perspective Fund, Ford Foundation, Surdna Foundation, and LEF Moving Image Fund among others; and she was a Film Independent Fast Track Fellow. She speaks both Spanish and English and holds an MFA in Film (University of Miami), an MA in History (UMass Amherst), and a BA in History (Brown University). Margo teaches producing as affiliated faculty at Emerson College and is a member of the Documentary Producers Alliance and Global Impact Producers Alliance.

Mentioned Resources:

📖  Book recommendation: Song in a Weary Throat by Rev. Dr. Pauli Murray

🌐  No Time to Fail and The Officials (Margo's films on election workers)

🌐  The Philadelphia Eleven film website

🌐  Time Travel Productions

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

• Why the future of the church is still bright

• Spiritual postures vs. spiritual practices

• The long, faithful work of building congregational imagination

• Creating culture change, not just cosmetic change

• Empowering transformation teams

• Leading with listening and honoring those who resist

• Why everything should be grounded in discipleship

• How to manage hard decisions with grace

• The danger of political syncretism in the church

Raymond Chang is the executive director of the TENx10 Collaboration (part of Fuller Seminary), which is a collaborative movement that is geared toward reaching ten million young people over ten years with the gospel. He is also the president of the Asian American Christian Collaborative, a pastor, and a writer. Prior to his role at Fuller, Raymond served as the associate chaplain for discipleship at Wheaton College. He has worked in the for-profit and nonprofit sectors and served in the Peace Corps in Panama. He and his wife, Jessica Min Chang, are proud parents of Sophia, and they reside in Chicago.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Follow @raychang502 

📖 Book: FutureFocusedChurch.com

🌐 TENx10.org: https://www.tenx10.org/

🌐 Asian American Christian Collaboration: https://asianamericanchristiancollaborative.com/

🎧 Jeff Keuss: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-8wu23-1703189

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

• Suzanne’s faith story as a preacher’s kid who found her own faith in adulthood

• Lessons from the newsroom that church leaders should embrace

• Why churches must get out of their cultural bubbles

• Communicating hard truths with kindness

• How Sabbath is an act of trust in God

• Building healthier boundaries in a 24/7 world

• Tips for better communication and storytelling in church

• Why Suzanne finds inspiration in Priscilla and other overlooked women in scripture

• Her hope for a less politically divided and more community-rooted church

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Her book: Wired to Lead

🌐 Suzanne's Website: https://suzannenadell.com/

🌐 She Leads Church: https://www.sheleadschurch.com/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode of the Future Christian Podcast, Loren sits down (literally, in person) with sociologist and Substack writer John Hawthorne to talk about his new book The Fearless Christian University. Drawing on nearly four decades in Christian higher education, John outlines why so many institutions have slipped into what Andy Crouch calls "zombie mode"—defined more by inertia than imagination. This conversation moves fluidly between Christian universities and local churches, asking critical questions about sustainability, fear-based culture wars, institutional loyalty, and what it looks like to center the real questions of a rising generation.

Together, John and Loren explore:

• Why Christian institutions often default to fear and control

• What it means to be a “zombie institution”—and how to wake up

• How schools and churches can move from protecting tradition to cultivating belonging

• The importance of legitimizing doubt and centering student (or congregant) questions

• Whether it's possible to hold onto theological identity without gatekeeping

• How online church and online education can erode or support community

• Why belonging may need to come before belief

John Hawthorne is a sociologist who spent nearly four decades in Christian higher education. He served as faculty member and academic administrator over the course of his career, spending time in five different Christian universities. He writes a Substack that often deals with issues in Christian higher education and has been regularly interviewed for Christianity Today, Religion News Service, Sojourners, Inside Higher Ed, and the Associated Press. His publications include A First Step into a Much Larger World: The Christian University and Beyond.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Follow https://bsky.app/profile/jwhawthorne.bsky.social

📖 Book: https://www.eerdmans.com/9780802884565/the-fearless-christian-university/

🌐 John's Substack: https://substack.com/@johnhawthorne

🎧 Jeff Keuss: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-8wu23-1703189

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics Explored:

• Why your mission must come before your money
• The spiritual practices that sustain long-term financial change
• How to rethink rent, real costs, and what generosity really looks like
• Why churches need to grieve the past to make room for the future
• A six-part “rocket ship” model for launching sustainable ideas
• The myth of quick fixes—and the value of faithful experimentation

Grace Duddy Pomroy is the Director of the Stewardship Leaders Program at Luther Seminary. She’s a lay, millennial stewardship leader, speaker, and financial educator based in Allyn, WA. She is the co-author of the stewardship book, Embracing Stewardship: How to Put Stewardship at the Heart of Your Congregation’s Life, as well as author of the free 2013 ELCA stewardship resource, “Stewards of God’s Love.” Her latest book, Funding Forward: A Pathway to More Sustainable Models for Ministry, was just released September 2024. Grace is also a consultant with Relèven, a charitable organization that lovingly preserves, restores, and repurposes under-utilized churches into community hubs and affordable housing.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Follow https://www.instagram.com/gracepomroy/ on Instagram

📖 Book: https://www.fortresspress.com/store/product/9781506493336/Funding-Forward 

🌐 Funding Forward: https://faithlead.org/funding-forward 

🌐 Releven: https://releven.org/

🎧 Mark Elsdon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/eldson/

🎧 Mark Elsdon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/mark-elsdon-on-why-we-arent-broke/

🎧 Jessica Dominguez: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/jessica-dominguez-on-mobilizing-churches-for-affordable-housing/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

This episode includes:

• How churches are transforming unused space into affordable housing
• The pastoral challenge of helping congregations grieve old models while embracing new vision
• Why engaging neighbors is essential before development
• The tension between mission and monetization
• What it means to be a church after Christendom—and why that might be good news

John Cleghorn became pastor of Caldwell Presbyterian in 2008 after 25 years in banking and journalism. He has served Caldwell as it rebounded from almost closing to become a vibrant, diverse, mission-driven congregation centered on the love and justice of Jesus Christ. His latest book, Building Belonging: The Church’s Call to Create Community and House Our Neighbors, springs from his congregation’s experience and his national research into the emerging movement of faith-based organizations building affordable housing on their property. Building Belonging blends theology and Bible study with case studies and lessons learned From the movement.  A native of Atlanta, he has lived in Charlotte since 1986 and has served on a wide array of non-profit agency boards in the religious and human services fields at the local and national levels. He is currently a board member of WFAE.  He is married to Kelly, a kindergarten teacher, and has two adult children. He holds a Doctorate in Ministry from Pittsburgh Theological Seminary, a Master of Divinity from Union Presbyterian Seminary and a Bachelor of Arts from Washington and Lee University. His first book, Resurrecting Church: Where Justice and Diversity Meet Radical Welcome and Healing Hope (Fortress Press), came out in 2020. 

Mentioned Resources:

📖 Book: https://www.wjkbooks.com/Products/0664268501/building-belonging.aspx

🌐 Caldwell Presbyterian: https://www.caldwellpresby.org/

🎧 Mark Elsdon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/eldson/

🎧 Mark Elsdon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/mark-elsdon-on-why-we-arent-broke/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

This episode includes:

• The difference between a healthy calling and toxic burnout

• Why our job titles aren’t our true identity

• What to do when you feel vocationally lost

• How rest and reflection help realign our sense of purpose

• Tools for reframing shame and rediscovering joy in your work

Arianna Molloy (PhD, University of Denver) is associate professor of organizational communication at Biola University. Her research focuses on meaningful work, work as a calling, and the connection between humility and burnout in the workplace. She is an award-winning scholar and educator who has published in the International Journal of Business Communication, Communication Studies, and Christianity Today. Arianna is also a consultant for organizations, business professionals, and ministries. Arianna and her husband, Allen, have one son and enjoy running half marathons, traveling the world, and drinking good coffee.

Mentioned Resources:

📱 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arianna-molloy-ph-d-168969246/

🌐 Arianna's website: ariannamolloy.com.

🎧 Past episode: Pastoral Health Roundtable Episode

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Topics Covered:

• How TikTok launched a movement of digital pastoral care

• What “decluttering faith” looks like in practice

• The role of dreams, labyrinths, and curiosity in spiritual growth

• Navigating social media algorithms and resisting rage-bait

• The promise and peril of building sacred spaces online

• Why progressive Christians need to speak louder online

Rev. Bethany Peerbolte is the founding pastor of Our Tapestry. This community meets entirely in digital spaces and gathers to declutter faith from abusive theology. She also creates Christian content on TikTok seeking to meet younger generations where they scroll. The stories Rev. Bethany hears from her 286,000+ followers about how churches have treated them inspires her ministry. “The zip code someone lives in should not decide what kind of God they know. Everyone deserves access to the radical love of God.” You can follow @RevBethany on TikTok, Instagram, and YouTube and learn more at OurTapestry.Online. 

Mentioned Resources:

📱 Follow @RevBethany on TikTok, Instagram, and YouTube

🌐 Learn more or join the community at rev-bethany.com

🎧 Past episode: Ted Smith:

🎧 Past episode: Elesha Coffman:

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode, you'll hear:

• Why Clint wrote about Progressive Church instead of Progressive Christianity
• How worship fuels justice, rather than distracting from it
• The danger of abandoning theological foundations for the sake of inclusivity
• Reclaiming leadership: Ethical authority in progressive communities
• Place-sharing: A relational approach to mission and evangelism

Clint Schnekloth is pastor of Good Shepherd Lutheran Church in Fayetteville, Arkansas, a progressive church in the South. He is the founder of Canopy NWA (a refugee resettlement agency) and Queer Camp, and is the author of A Guidebook to Progressive Church. He blogs as Lutheran Confessions at Substack.

Mentioned Resources:

📚 A Guidebook to Progressive Church by Clint Schneckloth  ✍️ Follow on Substack: Lutheran Confessions https://clintschnekloth.substack.com/ 🌐 Good Shepherd Lutheran Church: https://www.goodshepherdnwa.org/staff/ 🏳️‍🌈 Canopy NWA & Queer Camp: http://www.canopynwa.org/welcome 🍲 Mutual Aid Partner: Food Not Bombs https://foodnotbombs.net/new_site/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode, you'll hear:

• What moral injury is and how it shows up in church, healthcare, and society

• How healing circles are transforming congregations from the inside out

• Why forming faith is essential before welcoming or serving others

• How to foster unity across political differences through mission clarity

• The role of spiritual direction and communal lament in healing

• A hopeful vision for the future of Christianity and leadership

Rev. Dr. Susan Ward Diamond is the Lead Pastor of Florence Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) in Florence, Kentucky, where she has served since 2015.  Susan received her Bachelor of Arts degree from Texas Christian University, a Master of Divinity degree from Brite Divinity School, and a Doctor of Ministry degree from United Theological Seminary in Dayton, Ohio. Dr. Diamond has invested herself in ministry and mission through local, regional and general expressions of the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) in the United States and Canada, throughout her 33 years of ordained ministry.  She has served on the regional boards of the Florida and Alabama-Northwest Florida regions, directed numerous youth camps and conferences, and served as a keynote speaker of retreats and assemblies around the country.  She has served her denomination as First Vice Moderator for the 2011-2013 biennium of the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) in the United States and Canada. During her sabbatical in 2021, Dr. Diamond and Dr. Rita Nakashima Brock collaborated on a pastoral study grant funded by the Louisville Institute entitled Moral Injury: A Catalyst for Reform.  Following the study period, they have continued their work together to offer strategies to faith communities for providing support and healing for those suffering from moral distress and moral injury.  They have recently launched the podcast Soul Repair: After Moral Injury.  Susan and Rita are currently writing a book which they hope to publish soon.

Mentioned Resources:

🎙️ Rita Nakashima Brock's episode on Future Christian: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-vjamb-1871d36 🎙️ Soul Repair After Moral Injury Podcast (on all major platforms) 🌐 Florence Christian Church: florencechristian.org 📚 Coming Soon: A book on moral injury in the church (by Susan Diamond & Rita Nakashima Brock)

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode, you'll hear about:

• The origins and impact of moral injury in war and church settings

• Why wisdom cannot grow in isolation—and how loneliness undermines it

• The role of ritual in forming resilient, embodied communities of faith

• Early Christianity’s focus on paradise in the here and now

• What Protestantism lost when it rejected communal, repetitive ritual

• A powerful critique of institutional silence, spiritual abuse, and the theology of “waiting for heaven”

• How the Eucharist once fed thousands—and why we need that vision again

Rita Nakashima Brock, Ph.D., has been Senior Vice President for Moral Injury Recovery Programs at Volunteers of America since 2017. An award-winning author, she is co-author of Saving Paradise: How Christianity Traded Love of This World for Crucifixion and Empire (2008). She held the Endowed Chair in the Humanities at Hamline University 1990-1997, then became Director of the Fellowship Program at the Radcliffe Institute for Advanced Study at Harvard University. From 2001-2002 she was a fellow at the Center for Values in Public Life at Harvard Divinity School. She co-founded the Soul Repair Center at Brite Divinity School in 2012 and directed it until 2017.

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

In this episode, you'll learn:

• Why bivocational ministry is more than a financial necessity—and may be the future of pastoral leadership
• How redefining expectations can empower lay leaders and revitalize small congregations
• The difference between part-time, bivocational, and multivocational ministry models
• Practical tools for pastors and churches navigating role clarity and boundary-setting
• How seminaries and denominations can better support pastors in flexible ministry pathways

Rev. Dr. Kristen Bentley is an ordained minister with the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). She has served in congregational ministry in the central Kentucky area for more than twenty years, sometimes in the role of a bivocational pastor. Prior to attending seminary, she worked in higher education administration, serving at both Midway College (now Midway University) and the University of Kentucky. Since 2014 Kris has been working at Lexington Theological Seminary (LTS), beginning when LTS was awarded a grant by Lilly Endowment Inc. as part of its Economic Challenges Facing Future Ministers (ECFFM). She was hired to direct the grant project and as part of that work, Kris initiated research at LTS regarding bivocational ministry. The research concerning bivocational ministry has been supported at LTS through grants from Lilly Endowment Inc., including both Lilly’s ECFFM Initiative and later the Thriving in Ministry Initiative. Currently, Kris also is serving as an interim minister of a Disciples of Christ congregation in Kentucky. Kris is an alum of Lexington Theological Seminary, holding a D. Min. (2020) and M.Div. degree (1997) from LTS, as well as a M.S. in Education (1981) from Indiana University, and a B.A. (1979) from the University of Kentucky.  Kris and her husband, Perry, live in the Lexington area.  They have four adult children and three grandchildren.

Relevant Links:

Lexington Theological Seminary: https://lextheo.edu/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kristen.p.bentley

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristen-bentley-20a60b65/

Chalice Press: https://chalicepress.com/products/bivocational-ministry-field-notes-for-congregations-and-ministers?_pos=2&_sid=0718b64df&_ss=r

Eric Hoke: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-wbbf2-1412bed

Jeffrey MacDonald: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-vu5iw-126b98d

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Reverend Kyle Norman is a priest, author, and speaker.  Kyle holds Bachelor’s degree in Philosophy, a Masters in Divinity, and a Doctorate in Spiritual Formation. He currently live in Kamloops British Columbia with his wife and son. Currently, Kyle is the Rector of St. Paul’s Cathedral and Dean of the Territory of the People. Kyle is also the Author of “Alive, Loved, & Free: Finding Jesus when Faith is Hard” which tackles the tricky issue of feeling discouraged in our faith.

Relevant Links

Website: www.revkylenorman.ca

Facebook: facebook.com/ReverendKyleNorman

Instagram @reverend.kyle.norman

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

The Rev. Ben Crosby is a priest of the Episcopal Church (USA) currently serving in the Anglican Church of Canada. He is also a PhD student in ecclesiastical history at McGill University, where he studies the English Reformation. Ben is passionate about church renewal in the contemporary mainline, Christian discipleship and spirituality, and what the Christian past (especially the sixteenth century) might have to say about Christian life today. He has been published in Plough, The Anglican Way, Earth & Altar, The Hour, and Faith+Lead. You can read more at bencrosby.substack.com. 

Relevant Links

Mike Cosper episode: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-2m9ra-176f33e

Andrew Root episode: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-jtzdu-1500e5e

Lyons on Try Tank Podcast: https://share.transistor.fm/s/2983acab

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Dr. Lyons currently teaches evangelism, works with the Lifelong Learning team, and serves as the Senior Advisor to the Dean for Evangelism Initiatives at VTS. She also directs the EvangelismFormationLab@VTS, a digital portal on YouTube and Facebook offering original content from the Seminary as well as thoughtful curation of resources in evangelism and formation for the wider church. Dr. Lyons was a lay chaplain and teacher of religion in Episcopal schools for 20 years before being ordained a priest and then serving parishes in Washington, DC, eventually serving as Canon for Evangelism in the Episcopal Diocese of Washington. Currently, Tricia serves as a non-stipendiary priest at the Church of Saint Clement in Alexandria, VA.

Tricia is a member of the Presiding Bishop’s Strategic Cabinet on Evangelism and one of the original writers of the “Way of Love.” Tricia is an honors graduate from Harvard College, the Harvard Divinity School, and received her doctorate from the Virginia Theological Seminary. She is the author of four books on faith formation, The Soul of Adolescence, Teaching Faith with Harry Potter, What is Evangelism? and her most recent, The Evangelist’s Breviary.

Relevant Links

 Mike Cosper episode: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-2m9ra-176f33e

Andrew Root episode: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-jtzdu-1500e5e

Lyons on Try Tank Podcast: https://share.transistor.fm/s/2983acab

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

David Emerton (PhD, University of Aberdeen) is director of St. Mellitus College, East Midlands, United Kingdom. He previously served as principal of the School of Discipleship in the Diocese of Southwell and Nottingham and as a teaching fellow in systematic and historical theology at the University of Aberdeen. David is ordained as priest in the Church of England and prior to his training for ordination he worked in the City of London as a solicitor. He is the author of God’s Church Community: The Ecclesiology of Dietrich Bonhoeffer and Types of Ecclesiology: Five Theological Approaches.

Relevant Links & Episodes

https://stmellitus.ac.uk 

https://stmellitus.ac.uk/staff/david-emerton. 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-emerton-950444159

Justin Anthony - https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-cjrug-1541ed0

Alison Milbank - https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-ggj6t-166b3b9

Natalie Wigg-Stevenson - https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-4e8jr-ef1bbc

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Michelle Ferrigno Warren is the President of Virago Strategies, a consulting group which provides strategic engagement and project management support for churches and non-profits stepping more deeply into the work of public justice. She has been working in Christian community development for over 30 years utilizing her skills as an educator, worship leader, non-profit manager, public policy specialist & faith-rooted organizer & activist. She is an adjunct professor at Denver Seminary and a Senior Fellow with The Dietrich Bonhoeffer Institute. She is a fierce advocate for justice and has shared much of her journey toward civic engagement and activism in her books, The Power of Proximity, Moving Beyond Awareness to Action, IVP 2017 and Join the Resistance, Step Into the Good Work of Kingdom Justice IVP, 2022.

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Rev. Dr. Andrew T. Draper is the Executive Director of Winebrenner Theological Seminary in Findlay, OH. He is also teaching pastor at Urban Light Community Church in Muncie, IN. He has authored numerous books and articles on race, disability, and the church. Dr. Draper holds a PhD in theological ethics from the University of Aberdeen and an MDiv from Winebrenner Theological Seminary.

Relevant Links:

www.AndrewTDraper.com

www.UrbanLightMuncie.com

www.facebook.com/AndrewThomasDraper 

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Dan Kreiss (DMin, George Fox University) is the associate minister for mission and community outreach at Roswell Presbyterian Church in the greater Atlanta area. He was previously professor of youth ministry and dean of the School of Missions at King University in Bristol, Tennessee.

Efrem Smith (DMin, Fuller Theological Seminary) is the colead pastor of Midtown Church, a thriving multiethnic community in Sacramento, California. His books include Raising Up Young Heroes and The Post-Black and Post-White Church. Learn more about Efrem and read his blog at influentalglobal.com. Follow him on X: @efremsmith.

Episodes Referenced:

Walter Strickland: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-zmhss-174b7a6

Brian Davis: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-jd4vj-172854c

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Dustin D. Benac, ThD, is an educator, practical theologian and organizational strategist. He teaches at Baylor University’s George W. Truett Theological Seminary as the Co-Founding Director for the Program for the Future Church. He has supported and studied communities of faith who are navigating transition and uncertainty across North America. Prior to his appointment at Baylor, Dustin was a Postdoctoral Associate with Kate Bowler and the Everything Happens Project at Duke University. Dustin is the author or editor of multiple books and articles. His latest book, Adaptive Church: Collaboration and Community in a Changing World, explores what it takes for communities of faith to navigate organizational change. He is the co-editor of Crisis and Care: Meditations on Faith and Philanthropy and the Editor of Practical Theology, an international and interdisciplinary journal. His writing has been published by Faith & Leadership, Christianity Today, The World Council of Churches, Ecclesial Futures.

An accomplished speaker, teacher, and fundraiser, he has worked with congregations and researchers across Canada, the United Kingdom, New Zealand, and the United States. He is a graduate of Duke University, with Doctor of Theology (ThD) and Master of Divinity (MDiv) degrees, and Whitworth University. Dustin lives in Waco, TX with his wife, Casey, their three kids, and a lab, Lila. To join the conversation, go to dustindbenac.com or follow him on Twitter @dustindbenac.

Adaptive Church: https://www.baylorpress.com/9781481317085/adaptive-church/

Discount code is 17Fall24 for 20% off + free shipping

Program for the Future Church’s Impact Report: https://truettseminary.baylor.edu/sites/g/files/ecbvkj631/files/2025-01/PFFC%20Impact%20Report%20Final.pdf

X: https://x.com/dustindbenac?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dustindbenac/

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@dustindbenac

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dustin-benac-22069127/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dustin.benac/

Website: https://www.dustindbenac.com/

Episodes Referenced:

Ted Smith https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-w4nrb-15d747b

Scott Thumma https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-44b9y-154b15b

Justin Anthony: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-cjrug-1541ed0

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

David O. Taylor is Associate Professor of Theology and Culture at Fuller Theological Seminary and the author of several books, including Prayers for the Pilgrimage (IVP, 2024), A Body of Praise (Baker Academic, 2023), Open and Unafraid (Thomas Nelson/HarperCollins, 2020), Glimpses of the New Creation (Eerdmans, 2019), and The Theater of God’s Glory(Eerdmans, 2017). In addition to a range of scholarly and popular essays, he has also edited several books, including The Art of New Creation(IVP Academic, 2022), Contemporary Art and the Church (IVP Academic, 2017), and For the Beauty of the Church: Casting a Vision for the Arts (Baker Books, 2010).  He serves on the advisory board for Duke Initiatives in Theology and the Arts as well as IVP Academic’s series, “Studies in Theology and the Arts.” An ordained priest, he has lectured widely on the arts, from Thailand to South Africa. In 2016 he produced a short film on the psalms with Bono and Eugene Peterson. He lives in Austin, Texas, with his children and artist wife, Phaedra, with whom he has produced three sets of illustrated prayer cards (here, here, and here). He can be found online on Twitter: @wdavidotaylor; IG: @davidtaylor_theologian; and his personal website, www.wdavidotaylor.com.

Episodes Referenced:

J. Michael Jordan: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/worship-in-an-age-of-anxiety-with-j-michael-jordan/

Andrew Root: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/rooted/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Sarah Bereza holds a PhD and a Certificate in Feminist Theory from Duke University and has focused her research on music and theology in American Christianity. She is the author of Professional Christian: Being Fully Yourself in the Spotlight of Public Ministry (Westminster John Knox Press: 2022). Sarah is a lifelong church musician and currently serves as the Director of Music at Grace United Methodist Church in St. Louis, MO. She shares resources including a newsletter at sarah-bereza.com. 

Relevant Links:

Sarah-bereza.com

https://sarahbereza.substack.com

https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/worship-in-an-age-of-anxiety-with-j-michael-jordan/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Kokoro  Join in for heartfelt journeys that challenges the way we see ourselves, each other, and the world we share.

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Larry Lin was born and raised in San Jose, California, and he has degrees from Cornell University and Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. Larry has been a pastor for 10 years, and he currently serves as a pastor at Grace Life Church, a non-denominational church in the Baltimore area. Previously, Larry worked for a college ministry in the Washington, D.C. area, as well as for a non-profit called the One America Movement, equipping faith leaders with resources on toxic polarization. Larry enjoys writing about church and politics, doing deep dives on Wikipedia, and making music. Larry lives with his wife and two children in the Mount Washington neighborhood of Baltimore.

Dennis Sanders is a Michigan native, a lover of the Detroit Lions and Michigan State Spartans and an ordained minister in the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). He has degrees from Michigan State University and Luther Seminary. Dennis is currently pastor at First Christian Church in St. Paul, Minnesota and the host of the Church and Main podcast.  He lives in Minneapolis with his husband Daniel.

Relevant Links:

https://churchandmain.org/: Church and Main Podcast

https://thestateoftheology.com/ - Resource mentioned in the episode 

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Peter Elliott is a priest of the Anglican Church of Canada.  Hailing from the Niagara Region of southern Ontario, his ministry has included leadership within the Anglican communion for the full inclusion of LGBTQ people and strong advocacy for a spirituality that promotes social and environmental justice.  Over his 40+ years in ordained ministry Peter has served in senior positions internationally and nationally within the Anglican Church.  A long-time resident of Vancouver, British Columbia, Peter was Dean of Christ Church Cathedral (1994-2019) and currently is a coach and consultant in private practice.   He is a featured writer on arts and culture in the Anglican Journal-the national newspaper of the Anglican Church of Canada and has enjoyed working with the former Dean of Portland, Oregon, the Very Rev. Nathan LeRud as co-host of the podcast The Gospel and Musical Theatre.  Peter’s husband Thomas Roach is an artist working primarily in textiles.

Relevant Links:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Elliott_(Canadian_priest) - Peter has his own Wikipedia page!

https://www.echostories.com/peter-elliott-good-ancestors/

https://www.vancouverfoundation.ca/detail/peter-elliott/

https://gospelofmt.podbean.com - His podcast!

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

The Rev. Dr. Jesse Zink is an Anglican priest and also serves as canon theologian in the Diocese of Montreal. Born in Vancouver and raised in the United States, Jesse has also served in ministry in South Africa and England before his arrival in Montreal. Since 2017 Jesse, has been Principal of Montreal Diocesan Theological College, or, as it is widely known, “Dio.” Dio is an ecumenical theological college serving the Anglican and United Churches of Canada and is affiliated with McGill University. His latest book, published in fall 2024, is Faithful, Creative, Hopeful: Fifteen Theses for Christians in a Crisis-Shaped World. He is the author of four other books about Christian theology, Christian mission, and Christianity in the non-western world, including Backpacking through the Anglican Communion (2014) and Christianity and Catastrophe in South Sudan: Civil War, Migration, and the Rise of Dinka Anglicanism (2018).

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Mike Cosper has been creating music, radio shows, and podcasts for more than 20 years. He produced and hosted The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill podcast and is director of podcasts at Christianity Today. He now cohosts a weekly podcast called The Bulletin. Cosper also leads cohorts for church leaders and is the author of four books, including Recapturing the Wonder. He and his family live in Louisville, Kentucky.

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Alexander Lang is a former PCUSA pastor who worked in church ministry for 20 years. He has since left the church to pursue a technology business that is designed to help people form meaningful relationships. Alex’s interests include independent film, electronic music and deep conversation with people who question, doubt and want to dig into the most complex issues we face as humans. When he’s not working on books, podcasts or the Restorative Faith Movement, Alex enjoys spending time with his wife and two sons.

Previous Episodes with Alex Lang:

21st Century Spirituality: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/spirituality-for-the-21st-century-rationalist-a-conversation-with-alexander-lang/

The Most Viral Article on Clergy Burnout: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/alex-lang/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Episodes Referenced:

Pastoral Health Roundtable: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/pastoral/

Elizabeth Schrader Polczer: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/elizabeth-schrader-polczer-on-rethinking-mary-magdalene-part-1/

Yolanda Solomon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/solomon/

Chuck DeGroat: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/the-primal-wound/

Casey Tygrett: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/casey-tygrett-on-why-remembering-matters/

Grace Ji-Sun Kim: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/grace-ji-sun-kim-on-making-church-less-white/

Allison Milbank: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/alison-milbank-on-why-small-and-local-might-be-the-churchs-way-forward/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Walter R. Strickland II (PhD, University of Aberdeen) is associate professor of systematic and contextual theology at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary. He has coauthored or contributed to several books, including For God So Loved the World: A Blueprint for Kingdom Diversity. He is a host of the White Horse Inn podcast and founder of Cultural Engagement and Aptree Learning.

Episodes Referenced:

Pastoral Health Roundtable: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/pastoral/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Rev. Jocelyn is an author, speaker, and entrepreneur. Jocelyn's background as a journalist, executive director of a nonprofit, and community leader allows her to connect with people from all walks of life.  She received her bachelor's degree from the University of Iowa in journalism.  After receiving her B.A., she earned her master's degree in social work and her master's degree in theological studies.  Jocelyn published her first book in 2019, Breaking the Power of the Mask. Jocelyn is an ordained minister and the President of Faith on the Journey, a Christian Counseling company specializing in grief and trauma.  She is a Master Facilitator with the Trauma Healing Institute and the founder of the Women in the Ministry which helps women to start, grow, and sustain transformative ministries that change the world. 

Website: jocelynjjones.com

Social: IG: @jocelynjjones

            FB: @connectwithJocelyn

            Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@MeetRevJocelyn

Free Ministry Launch Starter Kit at sisterstartyourministry.com

Episodes Referenced:

Casey Tygrett: https:/https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/casey/

Kinsie Tate: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/restore-clergy/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Episodes Referenced:

Casey Tygrett: https:/https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/casey/

Kinsie Tate: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/restore-clergy/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Rev. Kinsie Tate is the Founder and Executive Director of Restore Clergy, a nonprofit organization whose mission is to support clergy with programs that improve wellness to cultivate faithful and sustainable ministry. She is a Licensed Professional Clinical Counselor and has a private practice where she has facilitated growth and transformation for clients for over a decade. She completed her Master of Divinity at Phillips Theological Seminary and was ordained in the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) in 2007. She served as an associate minister for 3 years prior to returning to complete her Master of Education in Applied Behavioral Studies at Oklahoma City University in 2010. She became a Licensed Professional Counselor in Oklahoma in 2012 and a Licensed Professional Clinical Counselor in California in 2021. She was certified as a Truce Coach in 2022. She lives in California with her spouse, who is United Methodist Clergy serving in a local congregation, and their 3 school age children. 

FB: https://www.facebook.com/restoreclergy/

Insta: https://www.instagram.com/restoreclergy/

website: www.restoreclergy.com

Brian Davis has been leading worship in the Denver-metro area for the last 25 years and has built relationships with dozens of churches all over the city. Authenticity and empathy have been hallmarks of Brian’s leadership, and his intention is to use these attributes to coach other worship leaders and inspire greater creativity and deeper spiritual practice in the local church. Brian has three daughters, and he and his wife, Jess, live in Lakewood, CO. He also serves part-time as the Worship Arts Director at New Denver Church.

Insta: https://www.instagram.com/greenroomleaders/

website: https://www.greenroomleaders.com/

Episodes Referenced:

Martha Tatarnic: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/why-gather-with-martha-tatarnic/https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-himxq-13e0aa9

Kinsie Tate: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/restore-clergy/

Brian Davis: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/the-pressure-to-perform-as-a-pastor-with-paul-romig-leavitt-and-brian-davis/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Chuck DeGroat is a professor of pastoral care and Christian spirituality at Western Theological Seminary in Holland, Michigan, where he also serves as the founding executive director of the clinical mental health counseling program. He is a licensed therapist, spiritual director, author, retreat leader speaker, and faculty member with the Soul Care Institute. As a therapist, he specializes in navigating issues of abuse and trauma, pastoral (and leadership) health, and doubt and dark nights on the faith journey. He trains clergy in handling issues of abuse and trauma, conducts pastor and planter assessments, and facilitates church consultations and investigations of abuse. Before transitioning to training and forming pastors, Chuck served as a pastor in Orlando and San Francisco. He and his wife, Sara, have been married for 30 years and have two adult daughters.

Book Buy Link

Chuck’s Website

Chuck’s IG

Chuck’s X

Episodes Referenced:

Chuck DeGroat: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/chuck-degroat-on-when-narcissism-comes-to-church/

Yolanda Solomon: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/solomon/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Rev. Dr. Michael Jordan (PhD, Drew University) is professor of theology at Houghton University. From 2002-2009, he was the pastor of Exton Community Baptist Church in Exton, PA. From 2013-2024, he served as Dean of the Chapel at Houghton before moving over to teach full-time this fall.  Over the summer, he is the staff chaplain at Camp-of-the-Woods, a Christian camp in the Adirondack Mountains. Mike’s wife Jill is a mathematician who also teaches at Houghton; they live just off campus and together are raising their five children: Grace, Jack, Lucy, Gabriel, and Anne. In his spare time, Mike enjoys singing, crossword puzzles and distance running and is a rabid fan of Philadelphia professional and college sports.

Facebook @RevDrMichaelJordan

michael.jordan@houghton.edu

theothermichaeljordan.substack.com

Episodes Referenced:

Andrew Root: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-himxq-13e0aa9

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Jeff Keuss, PhD brings over 30 years of leadership and managerial experience in higher education, health care and social services administration both in the US and UK.   In his various roles as a Professor, Director of the University Scholars Honors Program as well as Associate Dean of Graduate Studies for Seattle Pacific Seminary within SPU, Jeff continues to be actively engaged in research, fundraising, curriculum coordination, working with external publics such as churches and faith communities, major donor acquisition and retention, administrative recruitment, and annual fund development.  His commitment to faith development is seen in his $2.75 million in grant acquisitions as part of a $55 million initiative from the Lilly Endowment for the development of Pivot NW, a non-profit research and support institute seeking to research innovation models for the sake of engaging young adults in innovative social ventures with faith communities. His recent publication  Paul Ricoeur and the Hope of Higher Education: The Just University  (Rowman & Littlefield, 2020), speaks to his continued to work on the future of higher education as a place of justice and hope for human flourishing alongside a global network of thought leaders in educational innovation. 

Jeff is an ordained minister of the Word and Sacrament (PCUSA) and served several congregations both in the US and in the Church of Scotland as Assistant Minister of the Glasgow Cathedral.  He is a graduate of Seattle Pacific University (BA), Fuller Theological Seminary (MDiv), Harvard University (Masters in I/O Psychology), and the University of Glasgow, Scotland (PhD in Literature, Theology, and the Arts).

Episodes Referenced:

Scott Thumma: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/understanding-the-impact-of-societal-changes-on-congregational-dynamics-insights-from-dr-scott-thumma/

https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/ryan-burge-on-myths-about-religion-and-politics-in-america/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Dr. Grace Ji-Sun Kim received her MDiv from Knox College at the University of Toronto and her PhD from the University of Toronto. She is professor of theology at Earlham School of Religion. Dr. Kim is an internationally renowned lecturer and the acclaimed author or editor of 24 books, including When God Became White, Surviving God, and Invisible. Among many other accolades, Englewood review of books listed Invisible as one of the 12 important theology books of 2021, and listed Kim as one of 10 important women theologians that you should be reading. She is also on the list of the top 10 writers shaping our movement put together by the Center for Progressive Renewal. 

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Elesha J. Coffman is an accomplished historian and professor at Baylor University, specializing in the study of American religious history. She earned her Ph.D. in American Religious History from Duke University and has contributed significantly to the field through her extensive research and publications. Coffman is the author of The Christian Century and the Rise of the Protestant Mainline as well as Turning Points in American Church History. Her work examines the intersections of media, religion, and culture, highlighting the role of religious publications in shaping public discourse. Coffman's scholarly pursuits focus on how religious groups engage with broader societal issues, offering valuable insights into the evolving landscape of American faith and identity.

Episodes Referenced:

Scott Thumma: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/understanding-the-impact-of-societal-changes-on-congregational-dynamics-insights-from-dr-scott-thumma/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Rev. Kristina Lizardy-Hajbi, Ph.D. (she/her/ella) is Associate Professor of Leadership and Formation and Faculty Director of the Office of Professional Formation at Iliff School of Theology in Denver, Colorado. In addition, she co-directs the Doctor of Ministry in Prophetic Leadership at Iliff and coordinates the Certificate in Latinx Studies for the Iliff/DU Joint PhD in Religion. Her teaching and research interests include organizational leadership, liberative and decolonial approaches to ministry, intersectional pedagogical practices, and applied research methods. Kristina is the author of Unraveling Religious Leadership: Power, Authority, and Decoloniality (Fortress, 2024), author of the report "Latino Congregations: Trends from the Faith Communities Today (FACT) and Exploring the Pandemic Impact on Congregations (EPIC) Studies" (Hartford Institute for Religion Research, 2023), and co-editor of Explore: Vocational Discovery in Ministry (Rowman & Littlefield, 2022). She is an Ordained Minister in the United Church of Christ.

Episodes Referenced:

Scott Thumma: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/understanding-the-impact-of-societal-changes-on-congregational-dynamics-insights-from-dr-scott-thumma/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Megan Bissell is the co-founder of Future of Faith and an applied sociologist and researcher who specializes in the lives of young people, relationships, and group dynamics. She has spent her career turning research into actionable insights that people can use to make a meaningful impact. She has extensive experience  in leading research, facilitating workshops and educational programs, and consulting with organizations who want to enhance their relational and organizational dynamics. ​Megan was previously Head of Research for both the Social Research Lab at the University of Northern Colorado and then at Springtide Research Institute. She served as the Vice President for Research at the National Catholic Educational Association. She has a B.A. and an M.A in Sociology. Megan lives in Greeley, Colorado with her family of creatives, where she has no choice but to be inspired by those around her.

Video: https://youtu.be/m3lrNSEWrwI

Website: www.futureoffaith.org

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-bissell-7b503713/

Episodes Referenced:

Rebekah Simon-Peter: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/amanda-udis-kessler-talks-progressive-christian-ethics/

Josh Packard: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/stuck/

Andrew Root: https://futurechristian.podbean.com/e/rooted/

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Rebekah is passionate about spiritual growth and the communities it fosters. Over the last eighteen years, she has positively impacted thousands of leaders through her award-winning group coaching program, Creating a Culture of Renewal®. A dynamic speaker and master trainer, Rebekah has engaged and challenged audiences around the country. She is the author of many books including Believe Like Jesus: Rising from Faith in Jesus to the Faith of Jesus (Market Square Books, November 6, 2024), Forging a New Path, and Dream Like Jesus. Rebekah is a wife, sister, daughter, foster mom, mentor, and friend. When she’s not hanging out with family, you can find her journaling, hiking on the mountain, at the gym, or enjoying a good cup of coffee. For more information about Rebekah Simon-Peter, call (307) 333-5990, email office@rebekahsimonpeter.com or visit www.rebekahsimonpeter.com.

https://www.facebook.com/cultureofrenewal

https://www.instagram.com/rebekahsimonpeter/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/rebekahsimonpeter

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Dr. Amanda Udis-Kessler is a sociologist, writer, hymnwriter, and sacred music composer. Pilgrim Press published her book Abundant Lives: A Progressive Christian Ethic of Flourishing this past spring, and Anthem Press is about to release her book Cultural Processes of Inequality: A Sociological Perspective. Amanda is also a core contributor to the anthology A Liturgy for All Bodies: New Words for a New World, and the author of chapters in an additional 13 books. Amanda serves as the accompanist at her church, Vista Grande Community Church United Church of Christ in Colorado Springs, Colorado, and as a hymn text writer for the Rocky Mountain Conference of the UCC. She also develops and leads workshops on topics ranging from creativity to how white people can work against racism. She will lead a session on developing inclusive and antiracist liturgical materials at the 2024 UCC Musicians Association annual conference.

Her sacred music website https://queersacredmusic.com has over 150 free-use hymns and worship songs in score, recording, and video formats. Her writing website https://amandaudiskessler.com includes a repository of freely available chapters, essays, sermons, and liturgical materials. 

https://thepilgrimpress.com/products/abundant-lives-a-progressive-christian-ethic-of-flourishing-udis-kessler

websites and social media:

Writing: https://amandaudiskessler.com

Music: https://queersacredmusic.com

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/amanda.udiskessler

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

Yolanda M. Solomon is the director of discipleship at Epiphany Church in Brooklyn, New York, where she teaches and creates discipleship curriculum and resources. She has also worked in campus ministry at Columbia University in New York, where she was blessed to serve undergraduate students for seven years. Yolanda is a disciple of Christ, a Brooklyn native, and a lifelong Knicks fan, which richly fuels her prayer life. She lives in Brooklyn with her family.

Buy her book here:

https://bookshop.org/p/books/discipleship-as-holy-collaboration-helping-others-follow-jesus-in-real-life-yolanda-solomon/20713480?ean=9781514006191

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Future Christian Team:

Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer

Martha Tatarnic – Guest Host / Co-Host

Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer

Dennis Sanders – Producer

Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

The Reverend Doctor Robert Hurkmans is the senior pastor at Trinity Anglican Church in Streetsville, Mississauga. He is married to Sally and they have four daughters. Rob recently completed his Doctor of Ministry degree in Leadership Development from Tyndale University. Rob was ordained with Martha Tatarnic 20 years ago in the Diocese of Niagara.

Presenting Sponsor:

Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world. 

Supporting Sponsors:

Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!

Theology Beer Camp

https://homebrewedchristianity.lpages.co/theology-beer-camp-24/